Monday, October 26, 2009

More Tripe from Drake 1L – Kid Still Elated Over Honor Code Lecture

Exhibit A

“During the seminar we got to hear from a great panel with Dean Vestal, Dean Lovell, Professor McCord and 2 students who are the Student Honor Board Members representing the 2L and 3L classes. Having students present gave us a student's prospective that I thought was very helpful.”

Two questions come to mind: first, what was so great about a panel composed of three overpaid law professors and 2 student honor board members? Second, what the hell is a student’s “prospective”? If you want a third tier law grad’s perspective, then check out my blog and look at the sites on my blog list.

“The Honor Code is very important. It holds professional students at the law school to a higher standard. It is helpful to know that all students will be held to a high ethical standard and that if students should make bad choices, there are consequences.”

Yes, the sacred honor code. Isn’t it sick and deplorable that LAW STUDENTS ARE HELD TO A HIGHER ETHICAL STANDARD than the thieving industry, the bar associations, the courts, the schools (which rely on misleading, incomplete salary and employment statistics to lure in unsuspecting victims), the professors (who perpetuate the lie further and make six-figure annual salaries in the process), and the larger universities (which view their law schools primarily as cash cows)?!??

Listen, kid: you can blow your nose with the school’s precious honor code. (In two and a half years, you can do the same with your third tier law degree.) That is what it is good for. It is there to give you the idea – the false impression - that law is an honorable, ethical profession.

I guess you did make a poor choice in deciding to attend a third tier law school. And you WILL pay the consequences, i.e. large student loan payments, landing a low-paying job after school, and - very likely - the inability to find work as an actual attorney. If you go solo, you may pay dearly if a client files a formal complaint alleging incompetence with the State Bar. You will pay – NOT the ABA-approved school that trained you and let you loose on the unsuspecting public.

Drake 1L Adam Kaduce concludes with: “It was a great seminar to continue to remind students of the high standard that we as law students and soon to be lawyers are held to.”

Yes, the “profession” of law is so ethical that the ABA allows U.S. law firms to offshore American legal work to foreign lawyers AND non-lawyers. See ABA “Ethics” Opinion 08-451. The ABA is fully aware that there is a gross oversupply of lawyers in the U.S. market, yet they continue to allow more law schools to be built. The bar associations and law schools KNOW that there are nowhere near enough lawyer jobs to satisfy 45,000 fresh JDs every year.

The law schools continue to perpetuate the lie that “A law degree will open up many doors to you, in industries other than law. One can do anything with a law degree.” The harsh reality is that a law degree will limit your job prospects, as non-law employers will wonder why someone is willing to pass up a large salary in the legal field to work for them.

The law schools are aware that recent graduates will be competing directly with lawyers who have 10-20 years experience for low-paying jobs!! Do you really think you have a shot at a Public Defender position, when there are hundreds of experienced, competent private defense lawyers who are willing to take this job, which likely pays $44,000?!?! JAG positions are EXTREMELY competitive right now. Hell, the ABA and the schools KNOW these things, but they would rather keep the façade up. They DO NOT CARE that you – the student – will end up in significant student loan debt with little chance of paying it back. Remember, you are nothing to them.

Exhibit B

“Tonight a bunch of 1L's went the a Des Moines Buccaneers games. The "Bucs" are Des Moines's Hockey team. I am convinced there is nothing like a hockey game in Des Moines. The chill of the ice rink with the passion of the fans, there's simply nothing like it!!! Taking in a Bucs game is a great way to start a weekend or enjoy a weeknight. You never know what you'll see. We were busy as we watched the game applying our knowledge of criminal law and torts as the players smashed into each other. We had a great time as the Bucs rallied late in the third period. The Bucs lost but we had a great time cheering them on!!!”

Exhibit C

Wow! This is sad beyond measure. I wonder how long it will take this guy to realize that law is not great profession he thinks it is. Actually, I rest my case - it's a lost cause. Many 1Ls do not find this out, until it is too late.


  1. Nando...

    Question is live for your answer:;_ylt=AlkTCGCQRwX9qVGMCxazYEbpy6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20091025224001AAsmRAr

  2. Look at the email I sent to this delirious Drake first year law student earlier today - the subject was Legal "ethics":

    "If you want to see how ethical the "profession" of law is, just look at how the ABA continues to accredit law schools even though there is a HUGE oversupply of lawyers in the marketplace. There are 45,000 fresh JDs minted every year in this country. There are nowhere near that many slots for law-related work.

    Regardless of what your law professors may say, a law degree does not open up endless possibilities. A J.D. limits your future job prospects, as non-law employers will wonder why someone would be willing to pass up the "big bucks" as an attorney. They will also be leery of hiring someone they suspect will jump ship for a bigger-paying gig.

    Also, do you not realize that law students are held to a higher ethical standards than the thieving industry, the professors, the law schools, and the larger universities? These schools often charge more than $30-$35K per year in tuition. The reality is that, UNLESS you make law review and graduate near the top of the class, you will be competing against experienced lawyers for low-paying work. JAG, DA offices, Public Defender positions are extremely competitive. Who wants to hire a recent grad with no experience when they can hire a competent, experienced attorney for $35-40K a year? Hanging out your own shingle can result in disaster - personally and financially. Look at the number of lawyers in a Des Moines-area phonebook. You will be competing with these people for minor fender benders, work comp, and slip and falls. Nice investment, huh?!?

    Make sure to bring this up the next time one of your law professors/burned-out biglaw attorneys tells the class how ethical and honorable the "profession" is. Also, look up ABA Ethics Opinion 08-451 - this decision allows U.S. law firms to outsource American legal work to foreign lawyers and non-lawyers. What a tremendous 'profession!'"

  3. While I agree with your cause, publicly flogging this nitwit will make it almost impossible for him to get hired at a firm. Any google search under his name will turn this up and give an easy reason to not hire him. Might I suggest redacting his name from your critique?

  4. Maybe redacting his name is a good idea. :( I feel badly for him. Or, maybe he's on Drake's payroll. Even in my pollyanna days.. it lasted about 2 months... I could see through the bull shit. Consequently, I've never met so many unethical people as I have in the Legal World. Big law is a little cleaner... because the IRS would get them if they cheated.. but small firm... I've seen tax evasion and slavery. No joke. As in work off your debt to my firm... Whatever.. I digress. Ethics is nonexistent in our industry.

  5. if hes stupid enough to use his real name, he deserves not to get hired

  6. Yeah, I suppose.

    It's just kind of sad watching someone's career implode in real time. Both his own drivel (which employers will not respect), and the public beat down (which they will find amusing). Between the two, AK will receive a shrug of the shoulders and a move on to the next applicant in the stack.

  7. Nando

    I agree that attending Drake law and other 3rd and 4th tier schools is not a wise move. Probably can say the same about a lot of tier 2's and lower tier 1's if one does not have a scholarship or solid plan of what they are going to do from the outset (ie accepted into one of the JAGS, and in the case of the Marines, this can be done before 1L, family connections, etc.)

    I think that you provide and important counterbalance to a lot of the garbage info out there that makes students with 155 LSAT's and 3.3's in fluff fields who think that paying sticker at a third or fourth tier is a good move.

    That said, I think students should be able to figure this out pretty easily. I went to Drake for undergrad. Most decent students, especially those who wanted to go to law school, knew that Drake Law was kind of a joke. It was pretty common knowledge that it was tough to get a decent job coming out of that school. I see a lot of decent info on this site, but WHY did you go to Drake, especially because it was in the 4th tier not long ago (I can't be sure, but very possibly when you were looking at it?).

    Overall, it seems like a lot of the critiques you make are valid, yet very true of a lot of fields. Just going to and finishing most educational institutes, ranging from vocational to graduate to professional will seldom have any guarantees in regards to employment. I think Law is particularly bad in this regard because of the abundance of underqualified students in low ranking schools.

    I have written quite a bit, probably to the point of rambling, but I must ask two serious questions I hope you can answer. Why did you go to Drake Law, in spite of its low rank? More importantly, do you think that a student who plans to attend a regional tier 1 and execute a well-crafted plan can still make this work?

  8. I went to Drake because I received a full-tuition scholarship. This is the ONLY reason. Otherwise, I would not have moved my wife and our possessions 1,066 miles east.

    I think that someone who has reasonable expectations and a contingency plan (i.e. "What to do if I don't make law review") can attend a regional tier 1 and turn it into a positive - as long as they stay in the region. It is best if one has a law job lined up BEFORE going to law school.

    I also suggest prior experience working in a law firm or prosecutor's office - someone with experience in the legal field SHOULD have a better idea of the practice of law. However, I also knew some former paralegals and "runners" who did very poorly in law school.

    The problem is that the majority of law students excelled in their undergraduate programs, and they think that they will inevitably thrive in law school, as well. How many law students have a contingency plan in place?

  9. Read this, Nando.
    Of course.... You didn't post anything that is false.

  10. Here's a woman who needs the facts:

    She's decided on law school, but she wants to know how she can pay for it. We gotta talk her out of the whole idea.

  11. Done and done. I hope at least.

  12. "Maybe redacting his name is a good idea."

    I doubt it really matters. His poor grammar is underwhelming regardless. Anyone who could only get in a TTT and has not yet learned to use the word "well" instead of "good" is most likely doomed to unemployment or the cesspool of personal injury law or document review.

    I agree that it is good advice to get experience in the law field as a paralegal (in a mid-sized law firm). All of the paralegals with whom I have had the pleasure of working, who went on to law school, did so for that purpose and were able to make a fully informed decision when they enrolled in law school. Ultimately they all were admitted to top 30 law schools with 1 in a T14 and all of them made law review and went on to work either in Biglaw or a prestigious regional firm with over 100 attorneys (where they remain employed).

  13. Hi,
    There are lot of jobs in India . Just post your resume and get your dream jobs soon.

  14. What's really worse?
    A)This 1L who is obviously incredibly socially and academically inept.
    B)That Nando actually took time to tear the kid apart.
    Bet you feel awfully big after that stellar scholastic battle.

  15. Drake University is a wonderful law school. Almost everyone in my class founds jobs with great law firms when they graduated.

    At every law school, there will be some students who work, and others who expect the school to do all the work for them.

    Nando is not intelligent for himself. He devalues his own valuable degree from a good school. It is understandable why he has not found a job with a law firm--he is bitter grapes.

  16. Things didn't turn out so bad for that guy.

    1. I read the article. This kid ended up working for the realty grouped that he INTERNED with during college and law school at Third Tier Drake. He could have done that job without a law degree, and its accompanying debt.

      By the way, those idiotic, local "Forty under 40" listings don't mean any more than a fart in the wind. Basically, it's about as big of an accomplishment as landing in "Who's Who Among American High School Students." If that gets you wet, then you need to get out more.


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