Saturday, February 20, 2010

Second Tier Sewer: Villanova

Click on the link for the VLS Advantage Brochure PDF on the right-hand side of the screen. Apparently, Villanova has to convince local employers to send reps out to this prestigious second tier law school:

(By the way, look at how USN&WR treads lightly on the fragile egos of law school administrators. Villanova is ranked 61st by the rag – miraculously tied with three other schools- but is still listed as a Tier 1 school. Of course, once you get outside the top 100 law schools, you drop down into TTT land. Surely, law students and attorneys are not this bad at math!)

Are you in the mood for a good fiction story? Good, then head over to this web page, and look at Villanova’s Facts and Stats:

[Note: This should be listed as, Self-Reported Stats, Which Are Not Audited or Verified by a Independent Third Party. Also, by Facts, you mean to say Fabrications, correct?]

Tuition and Fees for the 2009-2010 school year amount to $34,860! (Take a DEEP breath and talk a walk around the block.) When you come back, we can look at living expenses. Oh, wait. The school does not list this on their Stats and Facts page. Perhaps living in Philadelphia is so cheap, the school does not want to give students the impression that it is in Appalachia.

Under Journals, you can see the distinguished Journal of Catholic Social Thought and the equally prominent Villanova Sports & Entertainment Law Journal. Yeah!! Employers are always seeking editors and staff of 5th rate legal journals! What’s that you say? Legal employers DO NOT CARE that you were an editor of the esteemed Villanova Sports & Entertainment Law Journal?! Oh, and the U.S. Supremes did not cite to it several times, in the last session?

But the school claims that a JD is a versatile degree that will open up many doors for its students. [Reality check: those doors will ONLY be opened to you, if you have the right family, business, or political connections BEFORE going to law school. Other than that, you MUST excel at school. Or work at Target.]

What about Legal Employment or Career Outcomes? What about Placement Rates or Starting Salary figures? I can only find Externships. (Unpaid, of course.) Actually, you - as a student – are paying for the privilege of doing grunt work in the DA’s Office or Volunteer Lawyers for the Arts – whatever the hell that is. And at Villanova, you are paying $34,850 a year for the “experience”.

Hey, we found something – on the bottom of the page. For the Class of 2008, Villanova claims:

95% of students were either employed or pursuing an advanced degree or other goals within 9 months of graduation.

Yeah, sure they were. And 95 percent of the women I have dated had not fully grieved over the end of the relationship within 9 months. Why not claim 100 percent placement? It’s not like the gutless ABA or NALP will verify the info.

Under Career Paths, the school asserts that 56% were in private practice. Does “private practice” include retail; insurance sales; bartender; waitress; fast food drive through operator; etc.? Do your grads get hired on in the following “big firms”: Starbucks, Target, Wal-Mart, AutoZone, Home Depot, and Petsmart? What about the smaller firms, i.e. Devil’s Alley Bar & Grill, McGillin’s Olde Ale House, Club 27, Fluid Nightclub, etc.?

Question: how can the 61st most phenomenal, amazing, dynamic law school in the land NOT provide a better breakdown of career outcomes?!? An oversight, I am sure. It couldn’t possibly be deliberate. I mean, the 61st most prestigious law school in the United States (with three others) MUST have placed several recent graduates in Biglaw, academia, or high-ranking government posts, right?!?!


  1. Actually, I went to Villanova and graduated in '03.

    Obviously, the economic landscape has changed and the price is up from $24,000 or $25,000 since I graduated. It wasn't all that bad, however*, for the top 25%. The school has a decent pipeline into the area firms including Dechert, Morgan Lewis and the other quote unquote large firms in the area with $140K starting salaries. You will see that a lot of the area firms have Villanova partners. I was in the top 10% and on law review and all of the students on law review had their pick of these jobs. I had 6 or 7 offers myself. The top handful of students also had offers from the several NYC firms (Davis Polk, Clifford Chance) that come to campus. The next 15% of the class had a decent shot at these jobs or had offers from mid-size firms. The next 25% or so was generally able to find employment. The bottom 50% was basically f-cked. I have several friends who graduated at the 50% mark and while they are gainfully employed as lawyers they haven't made a dent in their student loans.

    With all that said, the economy may have changed the law firm model permanently. Therefore, you wouldn't be wrong to cut the foregoing percentages in half. I.e., top 5% has pick of offers; top 12.5% has decent jobs, etc.

    As for cost, yes, it is too much money. Temple is much cheaper and basically has the same reputation in the city with respect to employers. I am a rarity. I paid sticker and I paid off my loans a couple of years ago. Of course, I rent and have no spouse or family. I actually have saved a net $250,000 since I graduated. Now, out of all of the people I know in my class who paid sticker at Nova, I am the only one who has paid off his or her loans. Granted, this is a small sample size.

    The school is not in the city but in the most expensive suburb, the Main Line. You won't pay Philly rent to live around there, but it is not much cheaper. One of the reasons people choose Nova or Temple is the area. One Temple grad told me he his car got broken into so much he ultimately left his doors unlocked.

    As for class makeup, it was white, white, white. Mostly ex-frat boys and sorority girls and daddy's girs. I got the impression that a lot of parents were footing the bill for their precious offspring. This made events, especially the law school prom, feel like an extension of college. On the other hand, law review ended up being made up of the handful of older students and people who worked between college and law school.

    As a whole, I am not recommending the school unless (1) you are not paying for it or (2) you KNOW you will be on law review. As for (2), of course you can't know you'll be on law review. But I think there is an advantage if you're not going straight from college. Even with that possible advantage, it is still a crap shoot to make the top 10%. Though one gripe: there is no greater truism then 'someone who didn't make the top 10% will tell you grading is random.' All of the people in my class who worked their asses off (constant studying, practicing exams, discussing exam expectations with professors) generally finished in the top 15% or so. So, I think's possible to do it with the right approach. Of course, it is still a $175K gamble. God forbid you get the flu exam week or suffer some other unlucky break.

    * This is actually one of the few things I remember - you are not supposed to start sentences with "however." That was worth it right there!

  2. @7:41

    I have never heard that you should not start a sentence with "however." Actually, I see it all the time in court documents and opinions (I'm a law clerk). Perhaps in academic writing its frowned upon, but in practice, its quite common -- and in my opinion, useful.

    Of course, this silly debate about using "however" to start a sentence highlights the point that law school is far too academic and does not provide enough practical experience.

  3. @8:47

    Sorry, I meant that as a joke. Three years of law school and the only thing I remember is where to put "however" in a sentence. And it is probably not correct anyway.

  4. Look, even Mr. Law Review at this second tier sewer does not recommend anyone attend Villanova. What does that tell you about the school? 'Nuff said. Don't forget that the Philadelphia legal market is over-saturated. it looks like the school cannot even bother to post starting salary info.

  5. A Villanova degree is worthless. Why shouldn't it be? The only question on an interviewer's mind is going to be "So, you couldn't get into Penn?"

    I'd be surprised if 50% of the class of 2009 got jobs, even as late as right now.

  6. Did someone say Vanillanova?

  7. I agree with the first comment, many of the students at 'nova tended to be from the upper middle class, and many had professional parents. Quite frankly, all you had to do was walk through the parking lot and you'd see an inordinate amount of nicer luxury vehicles.

    That said, I enjoyed my time at Villanova. (I wasn't upper middle class). The tuition wasn't quite as high. I haven't paid off all my loans yet, but I went in with a ten year plan (meaning I'd give it ten years to pay off my loans). I think that's reasonable.

    As for job opportunities, Villanova is definitely well represented at firms like Dechert, Morgan Lewis, Pepper Hamilton (as actual associates, not just staff attorneys). Blank Rome, Ballard Spahr, and Cozen O'Connor are decently sized (around 500 attorneys, as opposed to 1,000) and have many 'nova grads.

    Villanova grads do well. They're no UPenn, but really, how can you expect them to be?

    It's funny how this very blog made fun of Drexel and implied their grads would be crushed by the grads of the other Philly area schools, and now turns around and basically says 'nova is really no better than Drexel and the grads of every other school in the area will have hiring partners ask "why didn't you make it into UPenn."

  8. More proof that Villanova grads just aren't smart, and certainly aren't good at math. Thanks!

    I'm sure the hundreds of out-of-work grads feel awesome knowing that, hey, one guy got hired at Pepper Hamilton!

  9. Where is the math error Vernunft?

  10. I'm not sure what the "math error" comment was about.

    But if you have an extra minute, feel free to got to and click on "Our People" tab.

    You can search attorneys by law school. Pick Villanova and see the results that pop up. Majority of them work in Philly. Some work in Berwyn, which is a suburb of Philadelphia, perhaps closer to Villanova then center city is. And a couple work in the Wilmington, Del office. I didn't count them, but the seems pretty respectable to me. I didn't even hang out with that many people at school and I personally know more than "one guy" at Pepper.

  11. Vanillanova. I like that. This law school is plain vanilla, not French vanilla or premium-brand vanilla. There are no cherries on top, no sprinkles, and no flavored syrup. This school is plain old vanilla.

    Thank you for your comments. Even those defending this school concede that the school is not a good investment for most. And that was my central point - those who are connected (and have jobs lined up before law school) and those who excel academically at this school may be in decent positions. This means that many - upwards of 50 percent of the class - are indeed, screwed. Based on that, how the hell can someone justify spending $34,860 – of borrowed money - on annual tuition and fees?

    Vernunft is correct. Who cares if a few grads got into Biglaw? How did the overall graduating class fare in the job market? Remember, the school is charging $34,860 in annual tuition and fees. The students are also forgoing three years of full-time employment and income to attend law school.

    To the first commenter, I am glad to hear that you were able to pay off your loans. It is also nice to see that someone in your position recognizes that attending this school is a bad decision for most students.

    And to Wildcat #2, Villanova has a better reputation than Drexel, but that is not saying much. Being ranked 61st is no big deal. Schools ranked in this area are really not much better than many TTTs. Look at how the first commenter noted that the bottom 50 percent of the class were screwed – back in 2003! You could say the same thing about students at TTTs.

    Even you noted that many of the students were from wealthy backgrounds. These people would presumably have no problem getting into daddy’s firm or working for one of daddy’s friends. How many students OF MODEST MEANS were able to find good-paying jobs upon graduation? And how many of those made enough money to justify their heavy debt burden?

    What makes Vanillanova better than TTT Syracuse or the University of Memphis? In fact, in-state students at Memphis are only paying $13,710 in tuition and fees for the current academic year.

    Prospective law students get all worked up over the rankings, when in reality the rankings don’t matter all that much once you get outside the elite schools – or even the top 25 schools or so. Students get excited when they get accepted to second tier sewers, and then feel superior to their friends who only got accepted into a third or fourth tier toilet. And in 3 years, both are in similar positions, i.e. no job prospects, under-employment/unemployment, working outside the field, and massive debt.

  12. wildcat #2: So a bunch of people who graduated from Villanova in years past are working for Pepper Hamilton? Well, gee, that sure speaks to the job prospects of the classes of 2008, 2009, and 2010.

    It's thinking like that that got you the LSAT score that made you settle on Villanova.

    Here's your math issue: even if everyone in, say, the top 10% gets a biglaw $150k job, that won't support a "good" judgment for Villanova if the rest of the class is screwed. By your logic, Villanova is umimpeachable for the rest of history, because the governor of Pennsylvania is an alumnus, so obviously the statement "Some Villanova graduates do extremely well" is true (granting the easy assumption that becoming governor of a large state is doing "extremely well").

    Let's take the first commenter's numbers. Even in a good year (2003), 50% of graduates were "basically f-cked." Those are diploma-mill numbers. We are currently not in a good year, and the commenter suggests we shrink each non-f-cked subset in half. What this works out to is that 75% of the class of 2010 will be "basically f-cked."

    When people in the area say "Villanova's a good school," they're thinking of the high-achieving students who eventually became successful. If you look at the ranks of the Philadelphia elite, you'll see more Villanova graduates than, say, Widener graduates. But the numbers we'd see would be drops in the comprehensive ocean of "failed" Villanova grads, that vast majority of students for whom a Villanova degree wasn't worth more than a degree anywhere else, because they couldn't get the additional "I was on law review" signal on their resume. When hundreds of resumes come in, as they will in this economy, signaling is king. When the hiring partner is considering honest-to-goodness Yale graduates for the same positions as Villanova graduates, it helps to have some assurance that the Villanova grad won't subject you to massive malpractice liability. So you need law review and an astronomical GPA, not to GET the job, but to GET the...interview. After all, that Yale guy had a nice resume too - let's call him in as well.

    I'm surprised that people who've already gone through the entire law school experience, and then entered the job market, would be so taken-in by this propagandizing. Freshly-minted 1Ls are naive and expect that "median salary: $80,000" and "95% of the class employed after nine months" mean what they say. Your critical thinking skills haven't progressed a bit since orientation, huh?

  13. Very interesting. I like seeing a focus on 2nd tier schools, because the delusion, it burns, at many of those places. Most folks in the 3rd and 4th tiers know (or should know by now) that they are f*cked.

  14. While it's fun to insult people and their "math skills," I'm proud to say that I am well above the 98%tile in standardized math rankings. Attack standardized tests all you want.

    While it might be fun to continue on a long-winded debate about this, I've got to put an end to the craziness.

    So I'll break this down into quick bulletpoints:

    - Villanova is superior to your run of the mill "ttt" schools that you go nuts on. If you are willing to accept that at least 10% of the class get great jobs and 50% of the class gets decent jobs, then even by those figures it is superior to the ttts which this blog used to be focused on. I mean, you guys really go back and forth on this. Is Villanova better, or is it not better, than an average ttt. You guys argue this both ways, in the very same comment!

    - job numbers from the recent years are going to be skewed. The economy tanked. If you are going by those numbers, you might as well call some of the T14 schools "ttt."

    - Quite frankly, although I agree with the first commenter's assertion that as much as the bottom 50% of the class in 2003 may have been "completely screwed," perhaps we have a different definition of what that means. Perhaps they didn't get a permanent job. Fine, I'll agree with that. But Philly (up until maybe mid to late 2008) had a relatively strong temp market. Kids were being paid to sit on their asses "on call" to do nothing but be prepared for documents to load, I kid you not. They were making upwards of 75k a year (or more with heavy overtime). A few years of that, and you've put a significant dent into your loans (which were noticeably smaller a few years ago). Yes, in terms of prestige, these temp coders were screwed. But let's be real, there's a difference between being screwed into temping, and being screwed into homelessness.

  15. This is the first commenter.

    Actually vernunft, I think you summarized what I was saying. Why gamble $175K (the projected debt if you pay sticker and all living expenses with loans) on making the top 15% (or 12.5% as I guessed above)? When I look back I think I was very lucky. I was naive about prospects for the "bottom" 75% of the class.

    As for the question, how does Villanova compare to Syracuse or Memphis or similar schools? Well, I really have no idea. I was just relating my take. Though a colleague of mine who graduated last year said she was in the top 5 students at her T4 school, and only about 3 or 4 students she knew of got $100K+ jobs. Maybe some school Memphis has better prospects, or worse, than Villanova but I have no idea.

    By the way, my LSAT is not what kept me from going elsewhere. It was my 2.4 GPA in probably the least respected major in undergrad, from a piss poor undegrad.

    One last note: my definition of "basically f-cked" is that those students in the bottom 50% really have no hope of having a family, paying off their loans and living an upper middle class lifestyle strictly from their income in the legal profession. Sure, there are outliers, but the odds are deeply stacked against students who finished in bottom half (and now, probably the "bottom" 75%).

  16. As I see it, the major source of disagreement is a serious generational disconnect. And by generation, I don't mean people who graduated 20 years ago or even 10 years ago, but people who graduated as little as 5 years ago.

    A person who graduated from Villanova in 2005 had an ending tuition a whole $10,000 less than it is today. Over three years, that is a 30k savings. If i recall correctly, interest rates were also much lower, around 3 or 4 percent.

    More importantly, an '05 graduated in a vastly different job market. An '05 could just walk onto a coding job. Look at sites like tempattorney, and you'll see that agencies were recruiting people onto jobs as long as they had a pulse. If I recall correctly, many Villanova grads went into temp coding right after the bar before they even got their results, and then received a 5 dollar/hr raise after the results came in. This is no longer the case today. Temp coding has disappeared for the most part.

    In conclusion, Villanova may have been in reasonable investment if you graduated in the early part of the decade or before. It is no longer a reasonable investment.

  17. This has been a good discussion so far. Wildcat #2, to address your points:

    • First, Villanova is not much better than your average TTT. Biglaw only wants the top 5-10 percent of the class at your alma mater. At a TTT, the numbers are about the same – maybe slightly lower. At TTTTs, it seems that only the top few graduates get a shot at Biglaw. So, Villanova is better than a TTTT, but that is not saying much. (At least if someone attends an in-state TTTT, they will not be strapped with $150K in non-dischargeable debt.)

    • The economy did tank. But we are dealing with reality, not with how we wish things were or how they “might have been.” The lawyer market has been oversaturated for decades, so this is not due solely to the current state of the economy. It also looks like you want us to put T14s in the same category as Villanova. Well, that is clearly not the case.

    • Lastly, citing to the number of Villanova JDs working in doc review basements is a concession that the school was not a good decision years ago, let alone today. These jobs are now easily sent offshore. Please look at ABA “Ethics” Opinion 08-451. This allows U.S. law firms to hire foreign lawyers AND non-lawyers to engage in American legal work. Furthermore, how many people went to Villanova with the intention of becoming document reviewers? Once you have been on a doc review project, it makes it that much more difficult that you will ever be hired by a firm.

    Mallard makes a good point about the “generational disconnect” between those JDs from as recently as 5 years ago, and today’s new law graduate. Things have changed a lot in the last 5 years. The ABA Outsourcing Opinion had not yet been issued; this has also brought down the rates for doc review specialists in this country. Laypeople have better access to legal information, and many are now representing themselves. That being said, Villanova Law School was not a good decision five years ago. And it is an even worse decision today.

    In the final analysis, this law school is a very bad decision for most who enter the doors as students. The same can be said of your average TTT and TTTT. This school puts a fair number of its graduates in worse financial shape than they were in PRIOR to law school. As such, it should be featured on this blog.

  18. Villanova is a decent school and is held in high regard in the Philadelphia area. Still, why the hell would anyone borrow that much money to go to this or any other school. Don't give me the glossy brochure and phony career stats b.s. We as a country have a problem admitting that we shouldn't buy that which we cannot afford. It seems there are many people who just could not admit to themselves that they could not afford to go to law school and now they blame everyone else -the schools, the elites, etc. for their own stupid decision.

  19. Hey Nando,

    Thanks for the link earlier! 2 of the 3 DU women interviewed are actualy friends of mine from my time there, so I'll have to message them and see what they have to say.

    I actually printed it out and gave it to a co-worker who told me he's going to DU for LS next year because "no one else will give [him] a scholarship."

    Good luck keeping it, buddy.


    Cool, my federal tax dollars, and you proud Vanillanova grads' tuition money, went to help your former law school dean pay for sex with lovely prostitutes. You can't make this stuff up! Of course, no criminal charges were brought against this upstanding member of the "legal community."

  21. Old news.

    If I were a Villanova grad, I'd be more dismayed at Villanova's recent plunge from #3 to #7 in the AP polls this past week. Deans getting involved with prostitutes? Who cares?

    BTW, check out the National Law Journal's "The Go-To Schools" chart that ranks the schools for highest percentage of graduates hired by "BigLaw" NLJ 250 firms.

    Villanova is ranked at #40, tied with Ohio State. Hard numbers are: 39 grads hired by BigLaw, 234 grads total. Of course, that means about 200 grads didn't make biglaw. But maybe still better than a ttt.

  22. Villanova is crap.

  23. All of this bitterness is remarkable.

    It's really impressive that you could commit so much time to denigrating a school's worth, armed only with hearsay and supposition that the employment figures are grossly inaccurate. You're implying that anyone outside of the top 10%, or at best the top 50% will be either unemployed or impoverished for the rest of their lives. I'm sorry, but I haven't seen any evidence to support that. Aside from the probability that schools will present employment statistics in a manner most favorable to themselves, do we really know how far off the reported numbers are? It seems like you have no clue.

    All of the Villanova (and indeed, Temple and Rutgers) alumni I've spoken with are employed, regardless of their class ranking; they're able to pay the bills, support families, and make payments toward student loans. I'll concede that maybe they're not making $100k+, or even $80k+. But is that really how we're going to measure worthwhile employment?

    Something I find very frustrating about this, and other legal apocalypse blogs, is that you all have this myopic belief that success in the legal profession means BigLaw in a major, academia, or high-ranking government. Like it or not, most American lawyers are not employed within these three categories, and with responsible budgeting, most American lawyers are probably able to pay their bills quite comfortably without having to submit an application to Target.

    Further, from the timbre of these comments, I think it's fair to say that you have disdain for what you think the Villanova demographic is: privileged white students. I suspect that this is encouraging you to attack the school so aggressively. I'm not saying that this undermines any of your factual assertions (of course, I AM saying that other realities do), but I do believe that it might be personally satisfying to you to see students with a sense of entitlement humbled.

    The bottom line is that Villanova evidently is well-represented in the Philadelphia market, and respectably represented in the New York market. I don't have exact figures, but I personally know enough alumni employed in NYC that I can safely assume a fair number of grads end up there. Even without the NYC market, Villanova still has an excellent reputation in the Philadelphia area. Statistically, it is the second highest ranked school in the Philadelphia region (PA, NJ, and DE), only behind Penn. Assuming that many Penn grads place nationally, and those that stay in Philly take your darling Biglaw, academic, and high level government jobs, Villanova is in a good position to place its graduates in the region.

  24. Thanks to the last anonymous poster. Finally, a grounded individual to put things into perspective. It can be sickening to read comments regarding law school on blogs like this.

  25. I'm an attorney practicing in the Philadelphia area. I didn't go to Villanova Law, but it's a pretty damn good school. Everyone I know from 'Nova Law is doing fine.

    Villanova is considered to be the school of the blue blood elite in this city. I gotta say, Villanova Law gives you a fighting chance even in this economy, if you don't mind practicing in Philly.

    Philadelphia is a different animal than DC, New York, and all the other big markets. There is a strong regional bias towards Temple, Rutgers, and Villanova. Out of those three, I think the bias is most heavily towards Villanova.

    Can't say I agree with your blog post.

  26. I love the picture you chose for this post and I also love the passion you write with in this article.

    I think your points are pretty good, but I think you are zeroing in on the wrong school. I went to Villanova law and it's a legit outfit. Villanova has a good name and despite what it ranks in at, it is actually superior to many schools ranked above it.

    How many other law schools have a Supreme Court Justice rule over their final moot court round? How much do they pay them? hah.

    Regardless, I haven't had a hard time finding a job, and although my class placement pretty much precluded me from a biglaw job, Villanova's reputation has allowed me to find gainful employment pretty quickly.

  27. Current VLS 2L, well paid law firm job 1L summer, Multiple offers of employment in big law for 2011- no problems whatsoever finding employment.

  28. And this is the case for how many of your fellow Vanillanova Law classmates? Remember, many Biglaw firms - including those in the Philadelphia market - cut back on the number of summer hires for 2010.

    The American Lawyer reports that summer hiring was down 44 percent for summer 2010. Cravath reports an 81 percent decline, from 123 summer hires firmwide in 2009 to 23 summer hired firmwide in 2010. Pillsbury Winthrop summer hires are down 67 percent, from 51 positions in 2009 to 17 this summer. Skadden has decreased it summer hiring by 65 percent, down from 223 hires in 2009 to 79 hires in 2010.

  29. I graduated from the Villanova toilet 20 years ago (n boom times) and could not get a law related job. Career placement was not interested in anyone not in the top 20% of the class. I had to take an entry level job in property management after graduation paying a little over half of the government salary I made before law school. Respected attorneys I talked to at the time (Penn and other Ivy league grads) claimed Nova had a better reputation than Temple.

    Wasting 3 years at Nova was the worst decision I ever made in my life. After the ABA reporting scandal and the abysmal economy, I see no possible justification for enrolling at Nova Law.

  30. esquire never exposed!November 15, 2011 at 8:05 PM

    About Me
    Esq. Never I'm a 2nd Tier Toilet...err, Law School Graduate who has realized that the law isn't for me. I'll be sharing my quest to find a successful career in another field while also trying to expose the law school scam.

    Read: I’m a graduate of Villanova Law School. Class of 2009. I realized that the law isn’t for me. I’ll duck and hide from the fact I graduated from Villanova Law while trying to expose the law school scam.

    Back in February the little cunt posted a message on now defunct JD Underdog blog from Villanova’s Elaine Petrossian that was sent out to recent grads. He posted a graduate survey from Villanova's career services office. That entry was quickly removed from that blog.

    Here’s the video of Esq Never’s graduation ceremony.

    Like four-star admiral William J. Fallon would say, “Hip hip hooray, hip hip hooray, hip hip horray, Esq. Never!” And did I see Coach Jay Wright at the commencement? Which ‘wildcat’ are you?

    “Spread the Villanova Spirit! Spread it across the world. Once a wildcat, always a wildcat! We love you.”

  31. Nando:

    Please correct your header. According to the latest US News rankings, the Villanova law school has been officially demoted into third tier toilet land.
    That's right, this piece of shit law school, whose last dean got fired for doing a hooker, and which is now being sanctioned by the ABA for fraud, is no longer an “elite” second tier school (if it ever really was).

  32. The top law firm in philly is Morgan Lewis. Their attorneys are largely from villanova, rutgers, and penn.

  33. The American Bar Association is reporting that Villanova law school was among 20 other law schools with the steepest decline in applications between 2011 and 2014. Total applications were down 58%. Good luck to the school in financing the debt service on their spanking new building as potential admits head to Temple Law or realize that the Philadelphia legal services industry itself in a steep decline.

  34. According to a May 2014 report from Moody Investment Services, the good folks who rate bond debt on, among other things, Universities and law schools, Villanova Law school is ranked in the BOTTOM QUARTILE using their recent graduate employment metric. Yes, Villanova Law is in such good company as bottom feeder schools such as Thomas M. Cooley School of Law, Appalachian School of Law, and Interamerican School of Law of Puerto Rico. How long will before the parent cuts off this festering and parasitic appendage? GO WILDCATS!

  35. To flesh out the point of the previous commenter, Northwestern U. School of law researcher Harper published an article in May 2015 in which he divided all US law schools into three categories for analysis of law graduate employment prospects.

    • National Schools comprised of 23 schools
    • Regional Schools comprised of 88 schools
    • The bottom tier “Problematic sub tier”

    Guess where Villanova law finds itself lemmings? You guessed it, in the bottom Problematic sub tier. The author of the article advocates sanctioning these schools by reducing the amount of federal loan $$ available to students attending these festering dumps. Once Federal loan $$ are cut off, Villanova will be in the final stages of its ongoing death spiral. Good riddance. The University better sell lots of basketball tickets to cover the debt service on its brand spanking new and soon to be empty law building.


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