Wednesday, July 14, 2010

Cautiously Optimistic Lemmings: “What’s the Worse That Can Happen?”

This article, which originally appeared in The National Law Journal, is noteworthy for a few reasons: (a) prospective law students report being somewhat aware of the changing legal market; (b) “law professors”, law school administrators and NALP Executive Shill James Leipold comment about the structural change in the industry; and yet (c) law school applications are on the rise.

At the end of the article, reporter Karen Sloan provides a profile of four soon-to-be law students. Here is the TTR breakdown of the rationales.

Lemming Number One: The first student profiled is Allisa Klatt, who will be attending Third Tier Drake!! However, Alissa does consider this school to be “vastly underrated”. Apparently, she has not stumbled onto this blog before - or talked to any recent Drake JDs.

“Although Klatt is confident that law school is the right choice for her, the price tag of a J.D. still leaves her a little queasy. Drake offered a scholarship that will cover half her tuition, but Klatt still expects to take out about $90,000 in loans. "The first time I looked at the grand total of what it would cost to get a law degree, I cried," she said. "And then I realized that this is what I want to do. I'll have debt for the rest of my life, and that's that." [Emphasis mine]

Guess what, Alissa? You DO NOT need to go $90K into the hole for a TTT law degree! You will NOT come out of Drake Law School earning $90K per year. In fact, all students should follow the following sound financial advice:

“A good rule of thumb is that your total education debt should be less than your expected starting salary. If you borrow more than twice your expected starting salary you will find it extremely difficult to repay the debt.” [Emphasis mine]

Lemming Number Two: The next student/victim featured is Liz Payne, who is planning on attending the Univer$iTTTy of BalTTTimore $chool of Law.

“Payne, 25, insists she's not looking at the legal world through rose-colored glasses. She has friends who have been laid off from paralegal and clerk jobs with law firms, and is well aware that the industry is unstable right now. Even so, she would like to land a job at a law firm and perhaps specialize in the legal issues surrounding social media -- an area she manages for a Washington nonprofit.

Payne was influenced by her father's positive law school experience, which he told her helped to prepare him for the corporate world. She's been announcing her intention to be a lawyer since elementary school.”

[Read: “I know the market is unstable, but I’m going to law school, anyway! I can speshulize (sic) in social media law.”] Also, how many years ago was it when your daddy went to law school, Liz? Did he happen to have a business background, prior to entering the law school doors?!

Lemming Number Three: Golf instructor Jeff Holt has heard encouraging news from recent law grads and young lawyers. Therefore, he “knows” that he is making the right decision. He will be attending the 60th most amazing, thrilling, phenomenal law school in the land, i.e. Georgia State University Commode of Law.

"It's time for me to try something new and face a new challenge," he said. "I can't wait to learn a new way to think." [Emphasis mine]

Holt will attend Georgia State University College of Law in Atlanta this fall, with plans to practice business law at a firm. The location is ideal, he said, and the tuition is low compared to other schools he was considering. "I'm not as confident in the things I can't control as I wish I could be, like the job market," he said. "But golf has taught me that, at the end of the day, all you can do is try your best and hope that it works out."

Yeah, and after I post this entry, I hope that Salma Hayek wraps her legs tight around my waist. Oh well, you just can’t wait to learn a new way to think, can you Jeff?! Honestly, what a tool. You do not need to go six-figures in NON-DISCHARGEABLE debt – and give up an easy/enjoyable job – to learn “new ways” to think.

Lemming Number Four: We now reach my personal favorite of the group, Yazmin Wadia. I could slam her decision to attend WillameTTTe Univer$iTTTy Commode of Law in hilarious, biting fashion. However, I will let Yazmin tell her story instead:

"I'm now starting to look and see what my career options are with a law degree. I haven't been putting too much focus on that yet."

Wadia turned down a paying job at The Public Forum Institute, a nonprofit in Washington, D.C., that promotes public discourse, in part because she felt that she wasn't yet ready to join the 9-to-5 workday grind. Instead, she plans to attend Willamette University College of Law in Salem, Ore., which lured her with a scholarship and a strong public interest law program. She hopes to parlay a law degree into a job with a large nonprofit in Washington such as the American Civil Liberties Union, the Anti-Defamation League or Amnesty International.

While she hasn't done as much research as she knows she should into the job prospects for new law graduates, she understands that she'll face stiff competition to land her dream legal gig. "It definitely does scare me, knowing that you're competing in the job market with Ivy League graduates from Harvard and Yale," she said. "But it doesn't hurt to try. What's the worst that can happen?" [Emphases mine]

Here is the worse that can happen, Yazmin: you could end up with $150K in additional NON-DISCHARGEABLE debt and NO JOB PROSPECTS. You could then continue to defer your student loan repayment – and watch helplessly as more interest accumulates. If you default, you can count on enormous penalties, fees and surcharges being added onto your overall tab – as collection agencies take over your accounts. Your credit report will then alarm potential employers – much like this Harvard Law School graduate (except your law degree will say Willamette on it, not Harvard). Good luck in your future endeavors, Lemmings.


  1. When I first saw this article I was like "this is Nando's wet dream I should send it to him" but then I figured you would find it on your own and comment.

    These young people and their naivete' are why law schools continue to charge their outrageous fees. "I want to work for the ACLU" and other absurd pipe dreams are what keep the law school scam going strong. Can't wait to see a follow up article on these three in 5 years.


    thought of you.

    My favorite is "I want to do social justice law." A close second is "I want to do environmental law."

    When the BP spill first happened, BP had a brilliant idea: "hire" shrimp boats to help skim oil for $5000... oh and somewhere in there include that they absolve BP of any wrongdoing at any time. I wonder how many of those lawyers going door to door on behalf of BP said they were going to do "environmental law" back when they were at Creighton or Tulane law? I wonder if any of them said "I want to help an oil company avoid liability after destroying an entire way of life and an entire ecosystem."

  3. Oh, and it's pretty clear that Yasmin Wadia's not paying for law school. By the sound of it, Daddy's got it covered. Why else would someone not be "ready to enter the 9-5 grind?" Because they don't have to.

  4. These kids are so fucked! And they don't even know it. Well, they don't need the hard facts tomake their decision. They only need some encouraging words from family, friends, co-workers and college students to affirm they are making the right choice. The thing is none of those advice-giving pricks are going to be stuck with the student debt.

  5. Nice cartoon! That describes the education situation in this country perfectly. "I have a crap job, low pay, no bennies and a college diplama. I know! I need more education." Yes, you and everybody else.

  6. My breakdown of these 4 soon to be miserable wretches:

    1) Alissa Klatt: If seeing the cost of a Drake law degree made you queasy, wait until you get your first of many monthly love letters from Sallie Mae 6 months after you graduate. Ms. Klatt is clueless about the concept of carrying soul crushing debt for life. She casually says she will live with lifetime debt as if it were a permanent mole on her ass. Correction Ms. Klatt, you can live with a mole on your ass for the rest of your life but try living with $90K plus interest and penalties. Perhaps you will encounter your elder clients on the cat food aisle in the supermarket and you can compare whether the Purina's fisherman stew tastes better than Fancy Feast's Albacore.

    2) Lizzie Payne: Ms. Payne, your name is a harbinger of things to come in your future. Since you will take the plunge, might I suggest a way to cut your cost of housing? You see, the lovely city of Baltimore aka "Bodymore," has rows of many vacant houses you can squat in. I am sure you can save $12K a year on rent alone by lving amongst the crack fiends and urban derelicts that may have attended Bodymore School of Law.

    3) Jeff Holt: Hasn't being a caddy taught you anything? Jeff, have you ever tried to tee off in a sand trap under the oppressive heat? Ok Jeff, having a law degree is akin to trying to tee off in quicksand. Before you get your stroke off, you are already sunk. I am sure many of the older club members are successful lawyers- a product of a different generation and time. Chasing the dream of becoming like them will produce so much future frustration that you will be longing for the days when all you did for tips was wash balls.

    4)Yazmin Wadia: If you can't hack the 9-5 grind, what makes you think you can withstand the 8-10 grind? It sounds like daddy will be footing the bill for law school so I don't feel sorry for you at all. But good luck trying to achieve a "fit" with a firm with your slacker-like work ethic.

    In sum, all these kids are fucked. Do I feel sorry for them? No, they have been warned.

  7. JD2B, go suck another large bag of elephant dicks, you piece of shit.

  8. Yazmin Wadia turned down a paid position at a non-profit based in Washington, D.C. so she could enter Willamette University Commode of Law.

    In my hand, I hold the resume of a 2006 graduate of WillameTTTe's law school. This person has served as a finance director on SEVERAL Congressional campaigns.

    He was active in law school organizations, took part in a trial practicum, and worked for a large criminal public defense firm. He then went on to become a "litigation support contract attorney." Before law school, this man also managed a volunteer staff of 120 people for Paralympic Games. I met this man recently, and he had a very easy-going, engaging personality and he was witty. Overall, he had great people skills.

    Yet, he cannot find a job practicing law or an opening in politics.

    I guess Yazmin feels that she is not ready for the “rough-and-tumble” of the 9-5 workplace. Apparently, she feels the need to prove herself by earning a TTT law degree. Seriously, grow up kid.

    It is beyond sad that this child thinks that a TTT law degree from a school in Portland, Oregon is going to be in high demand at large, prestigious D.C. non-profits, such as Amnesty International, ADL and the ACLU. She then shrugs off the competition from “Ivy League graduates from Harvard and Yale.” Yazmin, the non-profits you want to work for will have the luxury of hiring Yale and Harvard JDs . Yes, that is correct. In fact, Ivy League-trained lawyers will be happy to work for the ADL or Amnesty International. Those offices will attract top law students and lawyers from the top law schools.

    I knew a man who graduated from Stanford Law School with high grades. He worked for the Sierra Club - because he WANTED to. How the hell are you - and your WillameTTTe law degree - supposed to compete with that?!?!

  9. Yazmin is nuts!

    Most people apply to law school because they're unemployed/underemployed and think that it's a decent way of "riding out" the recession and making themselves more employable three years down the line.

    This article on these four people is the gift that keeps on giving. I wish I had found it first. So ridiculous.

  10. The entire banking industry is orgasming in sheer pleasure at the thought of these four rubes. Yet another group of gullible, unsuspecting prey who willfully and gladly enslave themselves for life to Queen Sallie.

  11. This story was literally like reading about people who claimed that they firmly believed they could fly if they jumped off a high enough roof, that they could stay underwater and not drown indefinitely, or seeing someone claim that there is a 6 foot tall rabbit standing next to you as you talk with them. Magical thinking to the extreme.

  12. I was sitting in a classroom at my TTTT today studying for the bar exam when there was a knock at the door. A middle-aged couple ("the Lemmings") poked their heads in and asked if I wouldn't mind letting them look around. I welcomed them into my space. They came in and looked around. They were the happiest people I have seen in a long time. It was as if smiles were permanent fixtures on their faces. They asked if I was studying for the bar. I told them that I was. They then proceeded to tell me about their oldest son who had just passed the bar and went on about their younger son that was enrolling at my TTTT in the fall. They were SO proud. It was as if they really felt that things were going great for their boys--like they had made it. It was so uncomfortable for me. They had NO idea. I wanted to say something to them, give some type of warning, but I couldn't. I knew it wouldn't matter. Mr. and Mrs. Lemming would have dimissed my candor as bitterness. Their sons are special, THEY'VE worked hard, etc. I just let them walk out with the same shit-eating grins on their faces. Poor bastards.

  13. I think it's just basic psychology. You hear the horror stories and the naysayers, but something inside you says "It will be different for me." It's the motivation that drives people who can't sing to think they can be rock stars and people to wait tables for years waiting for a "big break." Sure your law school sucks, you will probably graduate in the bottom half, and you are 100K in debt, no matter, you think, Debevoise or Kirkland is just dying to hire me. Why? Because for me it will be different.

  14. i agree with the comment above. It sums the situation up nicely. Lemmings simply buy into the over-optimism that is such a huge part of the American mindset. "I will go for my dreams and make it," the nitwits exclaim. "Don't try to dissuade me with facts, reason or storiesof 'losers' who graduated from HYS and failed to make it. I am special."

    And then when these narcissists fail and move in with Aunt Joanie and study for the bar, hopefully they gain a better understanding of the job market and a sense of self-worth that is not tied into outside validation.

  15. The problem with this sort of over-optimism is that, unlike the wannabe movie star, you start out in the hole $150k. Please don't forget to add at least another $100-200k of forgone income for those three years. So you're really paying about $300k to go to law school.

    At least the wannabe movie star can live debt-free off their wages from waiting tables while they wait for that big break.

    It's one thing to be over-optimistic when the downside is not that bad. Buying a lottery ticket for $5 with the opportunity to make a $1m isn't going to ruin your life, even if the odds are firmly against you. Paying $50k for that same ticket is just plain stupid.

  16. As a former lemming, my honest belief was that even the worst students will come out employed in a field related to law, and that those jobs would be more rewarding than the dead end positions that most high school graduates can obtain. I can't believe how much a JD pigeonholes and brands you forever as a lawyer. It's staggering the amount of employers who won't even consider you because of the presence of the JD on your resume. Some will even bring you in for their sole amusement. I landed a face to face interview. The JD was clear on my resume, but the interview turned out to be a "why aren't you practicing law" or "don't you love the law" interview. Total waste of time!

  17. And if you manage to land a non-legal job, be prepared to be bullied and over-worked by an idiot boss (with a small penis) who resents you for being smarter than he is.

  18. Painfully Hilarious. Thanks for throwing in the loan Calculator!

  19. What a bunch of redundant crying! Why not just post this and be done with it to save everyone some time:

    1) Law School Can Be Very Expensive
    2) Employment Prospects After Law School Are Dismal
    3) This Applys To All Law Schools
    4) Lather Rinse Repeat

    It'll have the same effect, and you can spend more time shopping for tampons since you're always ragging.


  20. I'll do the honors, Sandi:

    Hey, you have a typo in your comment, therefore your entire point has no merit. In addition, you are a law school shill and cannot present a logical argument. You will fail at everything you do because you are not as smart as us JD failures!


  21. Sandi, you posted the same garbage twice. As to your step 4, is that how YOU go about changing your tampons? (If so, it may be time for you to change into another one.) Do yourself a favor, and grow a pair of balls, i.e. quit licking the industry's boots.

    To 7:35, it is so sad to see proud parents of TT, TTT, and TTTT students. They vicariously bask in the "glory" of their child's triumph - even when the kid just managed to graduate from a SECOND TIER SEWER like the Univer$iTTy of PiTT$burgh $chool of Law.

    Let's see how proud those parents are when their son or daughter moves back in with them, after receiving their diploma. Perhaps these people will be less proud of their child's (mild) "accomplishment" when he spends the next ten months looking for a damn job. Maybe, National Law Journal should spend more time and resources interviewing such parents. It would certainly be eye-opening.

  22. I work in Non-Law. My boss is a little asshole tyrant with insecurity issues. He also cannot accept the fact that his hairline is gone (he feels the need to comb his 14 remaining strands of stringy, long hair across his pallid pate).

    He can go suck a bag of moist buffalo dicks for breakfast for all I care. He treats those with bachelor's degrees and below civilly. If you have more education than this cocksucker, he cannot accept that and feels the need to insult you at every turn. You would think earning serious money with a 4 yr degree (at best)and averge intelligence would mke him happy.

  23. Great point at 5:27. At least those years trying to make it as an actor can be looked back on with fondness. Much better than wasting your irreplaceable mid-20s sitting through torts, contracts, property and the rest of that useless dreck.

  24. I know this is unrelated to your post, but please tell me you saw this story about the Linn County Attorney who had her job offer rescinded.

  25. The comparison with acting is a good one. Like professional sports, acting is a field where a select few make it and most people don't--and it has nothing to do with talent or hard work. I was one of the many, many folks who tried to make it as a thespian. It was wonderful, it left me with no debt and I'm glad I did it, but despite the lack of debt you do experience the "opportunity cost" of a few years out of the "real world" job market. You also have some lingering regret over "what if I had stayed in, maybe I would have made it..." OTOH I would not have liked to end up as many of my fellow actors did, broke and miserable at 45.

    I think the difference between those who drown and those who don't is simply that they listen to the voices of experience and accept that they don't know everything. I had to have that lesson slammed into my head, hard, and I'm glad I did. When experienced, successful actors told me that if I could find a job doing something else that I enjoyed and paid decently, I should do it, I listened and listened hard. Years later, when my family pushed me to go to law school and an experienced, successfully attorney told me not to go to LS unless I got full ride to a Top 10, I listened again. I don't regret for a moment not going to LS although I do occasionally regret giving up acting.

    But that's part of life, and part of growing up. Kids, listen up: You WILL get over it. You will get over your "dream" of "being a lawyer." If you really continue to long for it, defer the dream until you have a real job for a while, or get a non-lawyer job in the legal field to test it out. But you will get over it. For heaven's sake, it isn't even a "real" dream, like wanting to be a rock star or climb Mount Everest. It's just a dream of being a drone, a cog in a machine.

  26. - you expected would have a job when you graduated law school. You made an assumption and were wrong. Maybe the law school stats were fudged, maybe the system needs to be fixed, maybe you should have researched the field a little more before starting, etc, etc, etc. It doesnt matter.

    - not getting a job in the legal field isnt the end of the world.

    - you are in debt. So is everyone.

    - being in debt isnt the end of the world.

    - life didn't turn out how you expected it. Rarely does it.

    - maybe this is lifes way of telling you that the law field isnt for you right now. Maybe it will be later. Maybe you will be positioned for something greater because of your legal education. Who knows?

    Surely a more positive approach to your future, instead of anonymously blogging and complaining and "educating" potential law students, would be beneficial.

    Before you start hurling insults at me know that I have no vested interest in anything law related. Im just a quiet-until now-observer.

  27. Darian, I generally eschew "hurling insults" at detractors until they have PROVEN themselves to be intellectually dishonest shills/sycophants - or after they resort to incorrectly calling me a bitter loser living in my parents' basement. Maybe, you have not noticed that before.

    To address your points:

    First, I did not EXPECT a job after graduating from law school. I reasonably expected to have a leg up on the competition, i.e. that I would have a decent shot at a job, upon the completion of my "legal studies". (Honestly, what true governing body allows its member professional schools to pump out WAY TOO MANY graduates than the market can bear?!) Furthermore, I also did not anticipate that my law degree would be such a barrier to non-legal employment. The fact that you don’t think the schools distorting their stats matters shows your character. Would YOU have the same attitude if a realtor tried to pull a fast one on you, when looking at homes to purchase?

    Your second, third, fourth and fifth points go without saying. I knew these things before going to law school. Also, I only accumulated an extra $37K in debt from law school. I went to Third Tier Drake on a full-tuition scholarship.

    Point six is filled with meaningless platitudes. Who knows? Maybe I will be in a better position to have a three-way with Halle Berry and Salma Hayek, because of my JD, right?!

    All of your arguments ASSUME that this blog is all about me. This blog is about informing potential law students about the HUGE financial risk they are taking on, by attending law school. For instance, I could just sit idly by while legions of others are taking on SERIOUS six-figure student loan debt for a largely worthless product. It would be easier to do that. Alternatively, I could be a bastard and encourage others to attend law school – even though it did not work out for me and MANY of my classmates. (There are several shills/spineless cockroaches who do exactly this, by the way.)

    Remember, the debt is non-dischargeable, i.e. it is toxic debt, which cannot be discharged in bankruptcy. Read up on 11 U.S.C. § 523(a)(8).

    You can see where the law school Class of 2009 had 44,000 graduates. If you go to the first page on this PDF – from our dishonest “friends” at NALP, look under Employment Status Known. Only 28,901 of those positions REQUIRED bar passage. How many of those positions were attorney positions, where the employee is meeting with clients, working on litigation, or doing transactional work? How many of those jobs were for doc review? How many of those openings were filled by those who waltzed into their daddy’s law firm?

    At the bottom of page 1, we can see that 1,058 JDs from this graduating class decided to go solo. How many more decided to form small law firms with their law school friends?

    You can defend this industry if you want, but at least have some facts to back up your claims.

  28. It looks like "Darian" is the latest recipient of a Nando ass-kicking. Oh well, keep coming back.

  29. Dear Nando,

    I am/was a potential 0L going to attend you Alma Matter on a full ride, but decided to withdraw my seat because I was going for all the wrong reasons and would still be in considerable amount of debt.

    Thanks for your blog (and all the scam-bloggers) for the heads up!


    0L No More

  30. @1:43,

    I remember receiving an email from someone in your situation a while back; it may have been you.

    Anyway, you are very welcome. You are certainly making a MUCH wiser decision than Allissa Klatt, the student in the NLJ article who anticipates graduating from Third Tier Drake with $90K in debt - even with a half-tuition scholarship. Did you notice how she nonchalantly discussed this figure, as if she were talking about living the rest of her days with a small scar on her foot?

    I received a full-tuition scholarship from the Drake University Insurance Defense and Court-Appointed List Academy - and I still managed to graduate with $37K in additional, NON-DISCHARGEABLE loans. My wife worked while I attended law school. She had a Master's degree, but could not manage to earn more than $31K per year. We lived frugally and did not take many trips.

    The fact remains that Drake is not a strong school. Who gives a damn what the commode says about being located in Iowa's capital city? I know former classmates armed with STRONG grades, journal experience, a hard work ethic and a law license who still cannot find ANY work. Yes, that sounds like a great investment of one's time, energy and money - including lost income over the course of three years - doesn't it?

    In my last post on Third Tier Drake, a member of the Class of 2010 posted a comment where he noted that the outgoing SBA president spoke at graduation and mentioned that he did not have a job lined up. Yes, inspirational, uplifting news, right? This man was very active in student organizations, he was an engaging personality and he had great people skills. Yet, he could not find employment!

    Keep following this blog, and the other scam-busting sites. Feel free to help us backhand the shills, blowhards and frauds.

  31. Nando:
    Everything that you’ve said about law is true, namely:
    1. Top students from elite schools have great opportunities to rise to the top.
    2. The rest do not, and may only possibly grow wealthy after many years of hard work.
    3. Weak barriers to entry: There are too many law schools and they are deceptive.

    But aren’t 1 and 2 true of every realistic profession. In some cases, it is much worse. For example:

    Finance & Business Operations:
    1. Elite MBAs (Harvard, NU, UC etc) get serious opportunities (private equity, venture capital, hedge funds, I-banking).
    2. The rest do not. Only after many years of growing a business or investment fund do you have the chance to grow wealty.
    3. No barriers to entry. Many schools offer something called an “MBA” that is not recognized on Wall Street. Anyone, even bullshit schools (U. Phoenix, DeVry etc.) can offer an “MBA”.

    Engineering & Science:
    1. If you start your own firm and succeed (get VC funding and eventually have a liquidity event) there are no limits. Some people become billionaires.
    2. Engineers that don’t successfully start their own firms are just corporate employees who make $100k or less.
    3. No barriers to entry. Anyone can teach himself C++.

    In some ways, law is far easier for the best people to succeed in law than other fields, even if you don’t begin your career in Big Law. Starting a tech company or investment fund takes capital. Once you know what you’re doing, starting a law firm takes only a laptop computer, a cell phone and a virtual office.

    Everything on this website is true. But it’s also even more true about the other professions. The Great Recession has hurt all professions.
    At the end of the day, what are our alternatives? What else are we seriously going to do?

  32. That 1:43 comment really warmed my heart. Thank God a few lucky, smart, and prudent 0Ls are paying attention. Keep up the good work, Nando. You, unlike say, Lloyd Blankfein, are truly doing the Lord's work.

  33. I'll second 6:41's general train of thought that an MBA is probably an even worse investment than a JD.

    However, I do think Engineering is still a strong field.

    As for science, I've heard such mixed and widely disparate things that I have no idea what the hell is going on in that field. Even if you narrow it down to a particular science like biology or chemistry, it's still such a crazy inconsistent picture out there.

  34. mm56 said...
    Great point at 5:27. At least those years trying to make it as an actor can be looked back on with fondness. Much better than wasting your irreplaceable mid-20s sitting through torts, contracts, property and the rest of that useless dreck.

    So Effing True. I was so good looking and had a positive outlook on life in my mid 20s yet I spent my days in class and many nights studying when I should have been banging all those chicks that wanted to hang out at the club.

    15 years later and still practicing law, I think I will go hang myself now. Thanks for reminding me that I wasted my mid twenties going to law school and looking for a shitty job paying less then the bartenders I used to work with.

  35. I see alot of negative spillage for the oncoming new students of Law. It may not have been a positive experience for some of you and although your trials and tribulations are worth sharing and meant well, lets not discourage the few who still want to gain the experience and look forward to it. To the few who are bitter and twisted, you shall always be like that and need to improve your outlook and offer solutions and encouragement instead of calloused and mean remarks. I am hoping you will find peace and solace once you let the bitterness, hate and myopic views out.

  36. OSA an online schools directory for the schools in India where you will find a lots for school which are making their admissions forms onlineavailable for admission.
    List of schools for which you can apply for school admission online.
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  37. to July 30, 2010 12:00 PM:

    Stick it up your ass, 12:00.


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