Sunday, April 3, 2011

Barbara Boxer Delivers Another Stiff Jab to the ABA’s Beak

On March 31, 2011, Barbara Boxer, U.S. senator from California, sent the above letter to ABA “president” Stephen Zack. Here is an excerpt:

Most students reasonably expect to obtain post-graduation employment that will allow them to pay off their student loan debts, and rely on this information - which may be false at worst and misleading at best - to inform their decision.” [Emphasis mine]

Personally, I do not expect much to come from this letter. However, at a minimum, this will help spread the word to prospective law students, about the realities of law school. If you are a California resident, leave Boxer's staff a message here. If you live outside the state, then call and leave a message at 202-224-3553. Make sure that these policymakers are fully aware of the dire situation facing recent law grads.

Jason Dolin, adjunct law professor at Capital University, wrote a piece entitled, “Opportunity Lost: How Law School Disappoints Law Students, The Public, and the Legal Profession.”

“In my view there are two interconnected problems, both of which emanate from failings in the world of legal education. The first, is that law schools continue to produce large numbers of lawyers, flooding an already drowning market. The second is, that having flooded the market, law schools have refused to teach new lawyers how to swim – how to practice. Individually, the effects of either would be bad enough. Together, however, the effects of these two shortcomings have had a tremendously damaging effect on law students, the legal profession, and most importantly, the public.” [Emphasis mine]

On March 4, 2010, Brian Leiter, law professor at the University of Chicago, reported:

CA Bar President Howard Miller (whose son, by the way, is well-known crim law scholar and U of Arizona professor Marc Miller) writes in part:

“There is notoriously unreliable self-reporting by law schools and their graduates of employment statistics. They are unreliable in only one direction, since the self-reporting by law schools of “employment” of graduates at graduation and then nine months after graduation are, together, a significant factor in the U.S. News rankings — which are obsessed over, despite denials, by law schools and their constituencies....

[W]e need to be transparent with potential lawyers about the cost and benefits of studying law. All law schools need to gather, verify and report, in consistent and specified ways, the employment record of their graduates, as well report on those who may have started, paid tuition, but never graduated. A good place to start is with our own California-accredited and registered law schools, over which the State Bar and the Committee of Bar Examiners have jurisdiction.” [Emphasis mine]

This was written by Miller, then-president of the California State Bar, not an angry unemployed “loser.”

On September 2, 2009, former litigator Dan Slater, came out swinging against the ABA:

The American Bar Association, which continues to approve law schools with impunity and with no end in sight, bears complicity in creating this mess. Yet a spokeswoman, citing antitrust concerns, says the A.B.A. takes no position on the optimal number of lawyers or law schools. So then how about the schools? Can they save future generations of students from themselves?

If it means shrinking classes, don’t count on it. Limiting education is un-American, not to mention anticapitalist, even if many law schools appear to profit from what may charitably be called an inefficient distribution of market information.” [Emphasis mine]

Slater is fully aware that law school is a business. He also has the balls to call these pigs out.

Law firm management consultant Jerome Kowalski published this article, back in September 2010. Here is his conclusion:

“And, indeed, if you have reached this point in this note, in the unlikely event you haven’t already come to other obvious conclusions, here they are: (a) law schools must stop behaving like the beauty schools of 1990 and (b) law schools should make full, fair and candid disclosure to every law school applicant (before they even remit the application fee) and have each applicant sign a document that he or she has read the disclosures and understands them.”

Herwig Schlunk, law professor at Vanderbilt University, wrote an economic paper titled, “Mamas Don’t Let Your Babies Grow Up To Be … Lawyers.” He concluded that law school is a bad investment for most students.

Back on June 13, 2010, Brian Tamanaha, law professor at Washington University in St. Louis, noted that the anemic lawyer job market is NOT due to the current state of the economy:

“This dismal situation was not created by the current recession—which merely spread the pain up the chain into the lower reaches of elite schools. This has been going on for years.”

In the final analysis, the word is spreading to prospective law students. As you can see, law school is a lousy “investment” for most students – and not just according to bitter TTT grads. If you are considering law school – in light of all the overwhelming evidence that law school is a bad idea – then you do so at your own peril. By the way, Stephen Zack: wipe yourself, you're bleeding.


  1. Thanks for this post, Nando. I think it's your best, ever.

    Most scambloggers preach only to the choir. You have a diverse enough readership to make it likely MSM will pick these stories up. It's one thing for NYT to write about an unsympathetic loser, but quite another to write about Boxer's letter.

  2. Good post. I'm sure nando would've shown the poor bastard in the photo crapping his boxing trunks, if he could have.

    What I like about this blog is that it's unflinching. It doesn't waste time with niceties or trying to curry favor with the ABA.

    I prefer honest pessimism over un-called for optimism. Nando doesn't pretend that change is just around the corner. (I get the impression he feels things will stay about the same.) Or that the ABA will alter its own conduct. So what does he do? He embarrasses these clowns every chance he gets. And he does it with brutal honesty. He doesn't resort to false claims.

    There are others that just want to get publicity. These hermaphrodites know who they are. The Times wouldn't have covered this if the scambloggers had politely reporting the problems with this profession.

    L4L, Tom the Temp (Temporary Attorney) and others made this possible. They deserve credit, not crass shills that just want to capitalize on this.

  3. Is there anything left in America that has NOT been turned into a scam, designed to lure suckers into a lifetime of debt servitude?

    Higher education, legal practice, home ownership: the very achievable cursus honorum of bright kids only a generation ago. Now just bait for suckers.

  4. @ 8:43

    Your comment for some reason makes me think of the movie: "Gang's of New York" and corrupt political machines, roughnecks etc.

    Not that I really thought the movie was all that great, but it kind of showed how the people running things at the time were all just plain no good.

    And the analogy to the banking and political system, the ABA etc. today is obvious.

    Call it Criminal.

    Good for Barbara Boxer. I hope more Congresspeople get on board. We will see.

  5. OH NO!!!!! A twenty pound 'SETON HALL LAW' was deposited into the handicapped stall of Yankee Stadium! It smells like a dying animal!

  6. Before you sing Babs' praises too much, let's remember that this is Nancy Pelosi's buddy. California has about 20 ABA accredited law schools and another 20 or so that are unaccredited. The State is bankrupt operating on credit and Federal subsidies. Californians are feeling the pinch, even those that are taken by the law school scam. Isn't this the State that covered a Golden Gate law grad that was living in a trailer home? Boxer, just like shillingmesoftly faghag, are opportunistic people. How much you want to bet that this press release is the end of Boxer's crusade for law school transparency? Boxer's main constituents could give a rat's ass about unemployed law grads.

    Kids will continue to go against the advice of wiser people and continue to enroll in law school. The movie "Lincoln Lawyer" is already galvanizing college kids to enroll in LSAT prep courses. Sure, the schools are experiencing declining applications. That just means they will lower their stats to admit mediocre students. The brakes on the law school money train have been bled. The only way to stop it is a catastrophic derailment. Don't expect Babs to cause that derailment.

  7. @9:58

    If the Law Schools start lowering their criteria so that the quality of the incoming students goes down, the Legal Profession can only be harmed even more over time.

    On the present course the Legal Profession is in chaos anyway.

    Either way we lose.

    Remember teh baseball strike a while back, and how the Owners ctried to continue the season with minor league players?

    It just wasn't the same.


    Has anyone heard what these thieving bastards have decided about requiring the LSAT? I also don't think Boxer will do anything about this problem. This is just a way for her to show her constituents she cares.

  9. State Bar Organizations are corrupt to the core as well. At the very end of this clip, there is an interview with a fool who failed the CA bar 41 times:

    The cost to sit for the CA Bar exam is $584.00 according to pg. 2 of the application instructions (

    Now $584 x 41 = $23,944!

    If the CA State Bar had an iota of decency, it would only allow one retake to prevent people from wasting their lives chasing an impossible dream.


  10. @5:24-OMG! I thought more than 4 or 5X indicated gross incompetence and a candidate for a future malpractice suit.

    41 Times is an outrage.

  11. The punch in your picture is technically not a jab. It's a right hook.

    -MMA lawyer

  12. MMA lawyer,

    I am aware of that fact. I decided to go with this image, due to the vivid imagery. This guy received one hell of a nose job, didn't he? Look at the facial contortions, and the placement of the punch. In fact, this picture is as perfect as it is brutal.

    The alternate image was from the first bout between Julio Cesar Chavez and Meldrick Taylor, in 1990. However, that image shows a devastating left hook to Taylor's chin. In fact, it may have been the knockout punch.

    By the way, Taylor was winning this fight on points - at the time of stoppage. However, take a look at his face. It appears that he was hit by a train. According to the ringside physician, Taylor was urinating blood and suffered facial fractures - as a result of this match. He was also never the same fighter. I realize that MMA is an intense and dangerous sport. I am simply not a fan of seeing two men rolling around in a cage - with one man wrapping his legs around his opponent’s waist. Call me old-fashioned: I prefer when women lock their ankles around my back.

    @6:22 am,

    I would have no problem posting a picture of a guy crapping his pants. However, I know that the ABA is not defecating all over itself yet. Those corrupt pigs will continue to shade the truth, for the foreseeable future. I honestly do not expect this letter to lead to significant change. At least, this will help spread the word to those considering law school.

    To 9:17,

    I have an upcoming entry on Seton Hall. I profiled this festering stink pit, back on April 8, 2010. I have no problem re-visiting the urban blight known as Newark, NJ - so long as I am flushing this turd.

    Here is the TTR profile on $eTTon Hall. As an added bonus, I will provide salary info for SHU Law faculty. Look for another posting on this toilet, in the next week or so. You may want to wear some nose clips, when viewing the image above.

  13. love how nando likes to pretend LST doesn't exist

  14. Why should he give them credit? LST is a piece of shit. Those guys started well after the law school scamblogs. The androgynous cunt over at shillingmesoftly can keep sucking them off. Doesn't change the fact no schools complied with their polite reqest for better numbers. Not one fucking school. Geez, seems to me the aggressive approach is what has drawn the media coverage.

  15. LST is to the law school scam as to what Neville Chamberlain was to Nazi Germany.

    If you are not part of the solution, you become the problem.

  16. 8:09,

    Amen. No mercy and no quarter for these criminal ttt schools and deans

  17. LST started in July 2009. There were already a few blogs out there, like BDSL and TtT. Vandy students, eh? I think Herwig Schlunk at Vandy has done more to inform potential law students about ROI. His article was featured in WSJ. The LA Times had a piece a while back. New York Times has done several articles on law school being a huge risk. Let's go over this. LST got nothing done. One school agreed to provide better info. But quickly reneged. Kimber is a publicity whore and a sellout. (And not a very bright one, at that.) And we're supposed to praise these failures. The idiots think they're gonna work with the ABA to get shit done. Get real.

  18. Nando:

    You are right. That's a great picture. "Boxer gives a right hook" might have sounded better; but a well placed right hook leads to a knock out. Sen. Barbara Boxer certainly hasn't knocked out the law school industry.

    It sounds like you're a boxing fan. I'm also a fan of boxing, MMA; and all combat sports really.

    You have a great blog. One that I've had ample time to visit since the Great Recession started.

    Keep up the good work.

    -MMA lawyer.

  19. I'm tired of the overall push in my state for a four-year degree. Standards for graduating high school are geared towards pushing all students into a four-year school after graduation. Vocational tracks are no longer allowed and funding has been severely cut to the high school classes that allow students explore other career options such as car repair and welding, which are not bad careers to have.

    I will use my son as an example. He is currently sixteen and will graduate from high school a year early this May. Smart as a whip, but not not university material because his mind does not work in the way required to get the most out of the style of learning taught here. It's a waste of time and money for him. Besides, he's interested in welding, can go to a two-year school at minimal cost ($3000 total tuition, $5000 room and board) and get himself a certificate that's actually useful. He's taken some beginner's courses already courtesy of a local welding shop with the promise of a $25/hr. job upon graduation. All while recent JDs struggle to find something paying more than $8-$12/hr. Yet his high school counselors actively discouraged him from attending "trade school" stating that he'd make $8000 more if he went to a four-year school. I told him "$8000 more what? A year? Ten years? Over a lifetime? Do the welding certificate, you love it and you have someone willing to give you a job."

    We seem to be convinced in this country that more education is better, two-year schools are worthless and a blue collar job is absolute crap. We look down our noses in this state at those plumbers, electricians and carpenters who "make civilized life possible possible for the rest of us," to quote Mike Rowe. Instead we encourage each and every child to go the traditional university route, dangling in front of them the promise of a high-powered white collar career. And when that dream doesn't come true, we tell them they simply need more education and spin wonderful stories about the prestige of a graduate degree. Meanwhile the simple trade worker is the one making a good living (they as well as nurses and other health workers are the ones getting work right now in this state) while the JD is working a temp job at a little over minimum wage. More isn't always better and we as a nation need to get that through our thick skulls and stop feeding the scammers our future.

  20. Yup.

    And, our politicians on all points of the spectrum continue to spout the same old tired canards of how more access to "education", and by that they generally mean traditional college, will solve everything. It won't.

    Pumping out more bachelors degrees with majors in Political Science and Sociology is more likely a recipe for despair. That is, for anyone going into serious debt or expenditure to do so. If you have independent wealth, and can afford th luxury of dabbling in one of these fields, by all means. But for the majority, college, let alone law school, must now be approached with careful cost-benefit analysis.

    The problem? Kids today are being raised overwhelmingly by Boomers, for whom "education" in the traditional, four-year-college sense of the word, worked. Back in the day, that generation could score white collar jobs at GE and GM with their English degrees. Not the case for quite some time now, and we are experiencing the lag in the realization of this. That times have indeed changed.

    So much so, in fact, that even a LAW DEGREE, from the wrong school at least, isn't shit anymore.

  21. Just read the story about the Touro '09 law grad that was too stupid to realize that he got his client a mistrial through incompetence rather than skill. Kids, this is what awaits you if you attend a TTT law school and no one will hire you. You will become desperate and attract a desperate client who will hire you for a murder case. You will fuck up, be sued for malpractice, get suspended or disbarred and be ridiculed at multiple legal related websites such as Above the Law. Don't believe me? Google "Joseph Rakofsky." This guy was a nobody before today. Now and forever he will be known as a dumb, unethical lout.

  22. Just checked PACER. This dude has no white collar or bankruptcy cases associated with his name but if you look at his website, he comes across as a Jewish Johnnie Cochran. This, people, is an example of what these beloved ABA approved toilet law centers shit out every year.

  23. Joseph Rakofsky - further proof that TTTs will accept anyone with a pulse.

    Check out this blog entry for a compendium of the bullshit and lies this tool posted online - Screenshots from Facebook, MySpace and his webpage are included.

    If a toilet is clogged with a 20 pound TTTTouro, Nando needs to use this loser's head as a plunger.

    Out of curiosity, how many of you would pay to be at the Dean's Office at Touro and hear the administrator$ panicking about the negative publcity? Or to hang out in the student lounge and listen to lemmings whimper that their chance of landing a job went from 4% to 0.0000001%?


  24. But does Mr. Rakofsky not, in fact, represent the very MODEL of lawyering the ABA and our many shill friends espouse?

    That is, if you can't get hired, can't get mentored, can't get clinical experiences in a supervised fashion--why, PULL YOURSELF UP BY YOUR OWN BOOTSTRAPS. Right?

    Isn't that, in fact, what Mr. Rakofsky was trying to do? Pull himself up by taking on cases and "toughing it out" rather than looking for "handouts" (i.e., training) and someone to "show him how to do everything." Isn't, in fact, Mr. Rakofsky the POSTER BOY for the ABA model of pumping fresh JD's out onto the streets so that the community will have "available" legal services for all??? After all, you have to START SOMEWHERE. We can't all start out at the top, you know.

    Shills/apologists and law school industrial comlex cheerleaders--the floor is yours:

  25. I haven't yet seen the new movie "Lincoln Lawyer," or whatever it's called, but my guess is instead of promoting the idea of BigLaw to the future lemmings of the world, now the mainstream media is promoting the idea of shitlaw as a great reason to become a lawyer. Anything to drive those law school applications, I guess. More suckers for the feeder. By the way, after three years on a single document review project, my job has now ended, unceremoniously -- I got the CALL from the agency. You work for three years in a large firm with a shared office next to the department head and interact with all the partners, even going so far as to drop off documents at their homes, and these a**holes don't have the common courtesy to look you in the face after three years and say, "I'm sorry, but the job is ending." No, partners don't like to get their hands dirty. They'd rather have the stupid agency call you instead with the bad news. Maybe I'm being sensitive here, but then again I feel justified in my feelings. If this was a 1, 2, 3 week or even 1, 2, 3 -month assignment, that's one thing - but when it's three years, these partners owe it to you to "man up" and tell you straight up instead of being a bunch of pussies about it. In any event, that's my rant for the day. Looking forward to unemployment. How much do you get these days?

  26. Nando, you should use Rafkowsky as an example of the flawed legal education model in your upcoming debate. This dude had no experience or skill to be representing someone in a murder trial. The judge in that case was a hero for not condemning the defendant for having a shitty lawyer, which is often the case. It was fucked up to see Rafkowsky celebrate his result on a Facebook status update. It's sort of like celebrating a win by default because your adversary was involved in a fatal car accident and could not show up to the contest.

  27. Jeez people the Lincoln Lawyer is just for's a fictional story about a talented criminal defense attorney who gets an extraordinary case, which ties in extraordinarily to a past cause he's still haunted by. There's no scam by the filmmakers to "push more kids to pursue law degrees," they just turned an entertaining story into a movie. If some viewers think that's what lawyers come across on an everyday basis, then shame on those viewers.

    Guess any portrayal of a successful attorney is offensive and has ulterior motives nowadays.

  28. @3:54, you've misunderstood my comments. I never said it was a "scam." For years, the law schools have relied on the continued flow of applicants under the false impressions garnered by LA Law and other such nonsense. As I mentioned, I have NOT seen the movie yet, but my thought was that this movie, which I hear is good, will spur another generation of lemming to part with hundreds of thousands of dollars in pursuit of a shit law job. Compare with all the legal movies of the past 20 years that glorified the BigLaw career. Maybe you need to relax, idiot!

  29. "I haven't yet seen the new movie "Lincoln Lawyer," or whatever it's called, but my guess is instead of promoting the idea of BigLaw to the future lemmings of the world, now the mainstream media is promoting the idea of shitlaw as a great reason to become a lawyer. Anything to drive those law school applications, I guess. More suckers for the feeder."

    4:50- Your earlier quote clearly states "now the mainstream media is promoting the idea of shitlaw as a great reason to become a lawyer."

    Idiot, this statement clearly indicates that you believe there is some sort of motivation by the media to entice young people to go to law school, maybe rising to the level of a "scam."

    See, even "shitlaw" skills can come in handy.

  30. Nando, if you do a redux on Shittin Hall, you should note that the Valvoline Dean is still the athletic director and the Pirates failed to make the NCAA tournament, although some have claimed to have seen the Valvoline Dean sitting courtside during the NCAA East regional game play. After watching Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel last week on how much athletic directors make in Div. I, it would not surprise me if the Valvoline Dean is pulling close to a million bucks a year "serving" as the lulz skool Dean and Athletic Director. And he sucks at both ends of the post.

  31. Re: Joseph Rafkowsky

    The name alone validates why folks such as myself order the mailroom personnel to shred applications coming from Fucksberg grads and schools of such ill repute. Just as Touro used this mentally challenged grad's "employed within nine months" status to bolster its phony baloney employment stats, the school should own up to admitting and graduating this type of low caliber student. I am afraid the legal profession is proliferated with these clueless lemmings that believe they can handle a capital murder case by watching "Lincoln Lawyer" or "My Cousin Vinny." If I hired people like Rafkowsky, the firm's clients would run for the hills, especially since his name and Touro will be linked to medicrity in perpetuity. Ok kids, what have we learned thus far? If you attend a school outside the top 10, you won't work for a prestigious firm. Short of achieving that goal, you will take a stab at a solo shitlaw career. Then you will be the mother of all clusterfucks and fuck up a big case/matter. Google will ensure your name lives in professional infamy forever. Disbarment will likely follow (as I am sure it will in Rafkowsky's case--I am looking at you New Jersey Supreme Court Committee on Ethics). Game over. However, you will still have to repay the six figures of non-dischargeable student loan debt. Want to help the poor? Want to make a meaningful difference in this world? Go join the Peace Corps. and request an assignment to Calcutta.

    NYC Hiring Partner

  32. I went to Touro, and I posted my Transcript last week. You can see it here:

    The Hiring Partner is right. I am living proof. The 6 figure debt is for life, and when it is discharged or "Abated" after 45 years and in my old age, a fearful and whopping IRS tax bill on the remaining amount awaits, and the IRS will take everything I own then (If I even own anything). Kids, this is a true story.

    For those not familiar, Touro is a 4th Tier LS located on Long Island NY. They have a study abroad program in India now. (I wonder why?)

    In true Indian style, Touro has also been reincarnated as a Tier 2 under USNWR's new ratings system.

    Touro will probably disown Rafkowsky when asked about him.


    Keep in mind that a law degree is NOT versatile, despite what the $elf-intere$ted “law professors” pronounce, i.e. “One can do anything with a law degree.”

    Former Biglaw associate and current psychotherapist Will Meyerhofer slayed this myth in convincing fashion - back on November 3, 2010:

    “Why is a law degree not versatile?

    Let me count the ways.

    For one thing, it costs about $180k. Anything that leaves you two hundred grand in a hole is not increasing your “versatility” – it’s trapping you in hell.

    For another thing, studying arcane legal doctrine for three years (a purely arbitrary number) leaves you with no translatable skills. The arcane legal doctrine you learn in law school isn’t even useful at a law firm, let alone anywhere else.

    And let’s talk about the “skills” a lawyer “hones” in his “profession.”

    A litigator is about the worst thing you can be if you want to do anything else. Why? Let’s examine the skills you “master” as a litigator.

    Pumping up billables. Dragging out discovery. Dreaming up and laboriously penning pointless motions to create delay. Behaving in an oddly aggressive and hostile manner at meetings that end in a standstill. Organizing complicated information into folders, and folders of folders and labeling everything and organizing that into lists, and lists of lists, then billing for it by the hour. Researching recondite issues and writing memos you’re not even sure you understand. Wrapping your head around Byzantine procedural rules and forum and jurisdictional niceties and arbitrary court filing deadlines, all so you can trip up the other side with needless delay and expense.

    Okay. Now translate those skills into the real world, where people make products and sell useful services.

    See my point?”

    Do you understand that, prospective law student?! Meyerhofer graduated from NYU Law, and he understands the business. How many non-law employers want to hire someone they perceive to be an aggressive, type-A personality?!?! (Not all lawyers and JDs exhibit these characteristics. However, many non-law employers will assume that this is the case.)

    By the way, Meyerhofer’s analysis largely concerns those lawyers who want to seek a career change. Imagine the situation for recent law grads and licensed attorneys. Those on the interview committee will be VERY skeptical of such an applicant, i.e. “Why isn’t this person practicing law, and making the big bucks?” They will figure that you are a loser with no social skills. That is really going to impress them, huh?!

  34. @April 4, 2:50PM

    Couldn't have said it better. All we will hear from the shills/apologists/skools are crickets. If anything, they will join the bandwagon to have people disbarred by C&F committees for carrying "irresponsible debt."


    Under “Job prospects.”

    “Competition for job openings should continue to be keen because of the large number of students graduating from law school each year.”

    “As in the past, some graduates may have to accept positions outside of their field of interest or for which they feel overqualified. Some recent law school graduates who have been unable to find permanent positions are turning to the growing number of temporary staffing firms that place attorneys in short-term jobs. This service allows companies to hire lawyers on an “as-needed” basis and permits beginning lawyers to develop practical skills.”

    “Also, corporations are less likely to litigate cases when declining sales and profits restrict their budgets. Some corporations and law firms will not hire new attorneys until business improves, and these establishments may even cut staff to contain costs.”

    This information is from the U.S. Department of Labor, not a cynical scam-blogger.

    “However, because some large law firm salaries cluster in the $160,000 range while many other salaries cluster in the $40,000–$65,000 range, relatively few salaries were actually near the median or mean, as the Jobs & JDs report details.”

    And look, although there were 44,000 JDs pumped out for the Class of 2009, full-time salary info is based on ONLY 19,513 responses. Why would that be?!?! After all, fully 36,046 respondents reported being employed in some capacity – within 9 months of graduating from law school. Fully, 28,901 JDs reported being hired in jobs requiring bar passage.

    By the way, on the bottom of page 2, we can see that fully 24.9% of all jobs reported were SHORT-TERM. Additionally, 10.3 percent of all jobs were PART-TIME. Even by including those employed as solo practitioners, school teachers, part-time research assistants, bartenders, etc., the overall employment rate - for the JD Class of 2009 - was 88.3 percent. NALP needed to scrape together all sorts of info just to reach this figure. Going to law school is a great decision, right?!?! Take the monstrous student debt levels involved into account, as well.

  36. Nando,

    Have you read Professor Jewel's law review article on the influence of the Scam Blog Movement yet? You are cited in the article.

    Check it out:

  37. Nando, congratulations for being featured in this latest law review article:

    Is there a way we can listen in on the April 7th debate?

  38. Anyone else having trouble posting? I click on "Post Comment" and the blog refreshes with my entry. However, when I visited TTR again, it was gone. I tried cutting and pasting from two different computers and I get the same problem.

    Wonder if the greedy swine in the faculty and administration have hacked into Blogspot to take down this blog.

  39. I would also wish to congratulate Nando for TTR's coverage in "You’re Doing It Wrong: How the Anti-Law School Scam Blogging Movement Can Shape the Legal Profession".

    Although I came across your muckracking blog when it was too late, I have reused your arguments and forwarded your school profiles to people who are intersted in applying to law school. Thankfully, with your help, I have stopped 2 students from my undergraduate alma mater from falling prey to the deceptive employment statistics published by TTToilets with the full blessing of the ABA.

    Here are a few quotes from the law review article:

    pg. 266 "For instance, Nando from Third Tier Reality routinely publishes “profiles” of law schools with high tuition costs and a low U.S. News and World Report ranking.160 Full of scatological imagery of overflowing toilets, disgusting sewage drains, and fecal matter, this author does not mince words or images as he holds out these institutions for public shame.161"

    pg. 276 "By juxtaposing overflowing toilets with law schools and using photographs of pigs to represent the ABA or law school administrators, Scam Bloggers are not highly concerned with hurting feelings or making a formal text-based argument."

  40. @ 2:38 pm,

    You need to register with Westlaw, and enroll for the program, in order to hear the debate. It is free to do so. Cryn Johannsen will serve as moderator. Here are the other panelists: Brian Tamanaha of 18th ranked Washington University in St. Louis; William Henderson of 23rd-rated Indiana University; Phillip Closius from the 117th greatest law school in the land, the Univer$iTTTy of BalTTTimore; and Robert Ackerman of 121st ranked Wayne $TTTaTTTe Univer$iTTTy. This should be informative and fun.

    With regards to the Minnesota Journal of Law, Science & Technology piece, it is about time this thing came out. The article was supposed to be online in mid-January. Then, "executive administrator" Monica Wittsock kept pushing the publication date back. When I called her, she told me that the piece would be available in mid-February. Oh well. What can you expect from a fifth-rate law journal? It is comical that a technology publication is so technologically impaired.

    Overall, the tone and content are pretty solid - as far as law review articles are concerned. The scam-bloggers have worked hard to detail the extent of this deceitful industry. Due to our persistence, focus, graphic depictions and honesty, we have received some mainstream media coverage.

    By the way, check out my comment to this nonsense. Jonah Dyer graduated from Third Tier Drake in 2010. He started his own toilet firm, with three classmates. But the guy has the nerve to publish this garbage:

    "I am a 2010 law school graduate with some thoughts to share with recent graduates, prospective law students and scambloggers alike:

    All of the statistics and other data scambloggers use to "debunk the law school myth" were available when they were thinking (or not really thinking) about whether to attend law school.

    If they would have spent half the time researching then that they spend complaining now they would have known that expecting to get a high-paying job right out of law school simply because they finished it is delusional. They would have known that so much more than a diploma goes into getting a job: their grades, their school, their activities, their network and, yes, even their personalities.

    Claiming that law schools didn't do enough to educate them about the risks of attending is little more than a manifestation of an overbearing sense of self-entitlement, mixed with an attempt to avoid responsibility for their choices. The fact is, no one held a gun to their heads to make them go to law school—the devil did not make them do it.

    Jonah Hammer Dyer
    Des Moines, Iowa"

    “Jonah graduated from Drake Law School in 2010 with Honors and earned the Litigation and Dispute Resolution Certificate.”

    He also participated in Moot Court and advanced clinic. He currently practices toilet law – and yet this dolt supports the law school pigs.

  41. Regardless of the relative success or lack thereof of Mr. Dyer, I still cannot see why his perspective must require he differ with the concept of the scamblogs' frankly sharing with prospective law students the very real risks of law school. I would think he would applaud that.

    In fact, Mr. Dyer's expressed negative view on scambloggers smacks of irrationality: it is the scambloggers who actively work to whittle down his potential future competitors. Why on Earth would he be AGAINST scambloggers? Hell, he should be sending a check in appreciation of at least keeping some people out of this festeringly overcrowded market.

    His expressed views, instead, reek of his own sense of buyer's remorse, turned outward, in the stark realization that HE is the one trapped in this "profession." In fact, I cannot think of even ONE scamblogger ever claiming they attended law school under force or duress. Where he comes up with that implication, we can only wonder.

    Silly young man.

  42. Dyer is a dumbass and even looks like a caveman in his firm bio. Look at the Cromagnon forehead, chin and deepset eyes. He should not only be sending a check to Nando, JJD, and the others. He ought to be on his knees kissing thier ass.

  43. Is Jonah "Hammer" Dyer related to any of these other shitlaw attorneys?

  44. Jonah and the Hammer have one thing in common: they are both tools.

  45. 'Comments
    1. Nando
    Apr 5, 2011 4:16 PM CDT
    By the way, Jonah Hammer Dyer and his wife had at least two kids while he was in law school - at Third Tier Drake. His wife did not work, while Jonah was learning “legal doctrine” and lots of theory. Ask him how they paid the bills, during this time. His wife stayed home to raise the kids. They were receiving WIC, Food Stamps, and other forms of public assistance. In sum, they also used the taxpayer’s wallet to expand their family. What a beacon of integrity and self-reliance, huh?!?!

    Jonah has the audacity to lash out against scam-bloggers and others who have pointed out that law school is a poor investment. Sure, Jonah was on secondary journal and apparently had strong grades. However, he evidently was unable to secure a law firm job after law school. It is beyond comical that a person such as Dyer is sounding off - when he is in the same boat as a lot of other recent JDs. This takes shilling, intellectual dishonesty and self-deceit to a whole new level. Apparently, he would advise others to attend law school - even though he had to (desperately) hang out his own shingle, with other recent law grads.'

    Not sure if this clown is related to the other shit lawyers. I do know Nando dropped the hammer on this guy's ass. Good job with a nice swift kick in the pants.

  46. Nando:

    Your fans are absolutely crying out for you to profile attorney (for now) Joseph Rafkowsky, who:

    1. Graduated from TTTouro last year.
    2. Couldn't find a job in the supersaturated market and was desperate for clients.
    3. Followed the advice of the law school shills and pulled himself up by the bootstraps, started his own practice (and therefore counted as employed) and solicited business on the internet.
    4. Since law schools teach absolutely fucking nothing, he couldn’t handle a criminal case.

    He screwed up so bad, it is comical.

    If you don’t profile him, I’m coming over to Des Moines to put you in a painful arm lock.

    -MMA lawyer

  47. Eventually, market forces and government oversight will bring an end to the hey day of the law school industry. I am of the firm belief that in 10 years there will be fewer schools than there are today.

    I would love to know how applications are doing at Cooley, Thomas Jefferson, Ave Maria Pizza and others. If applications are down 15-20% industry wide, these fourth tier scams have got to be reeling. It's going to be fun to watch them shutter.

  48. Mr. NYhiringpartner,

    I guess I don't understand whats wrong with small firm practice, inhouse, or compliance work? I wouldn't turn down a BIGLAW opportunity of course.

    I understand why appearances and being Ivy Leagued in that glitzy world make sense. But the way I understand it, experience is far more valuable. With 5-7 years of practicing expertise under your belt you would certainly have more value-added than some random grad from Columbia or Yale with nothing but a JD.

    So shouldn't a solid work history, a well-rounded porfolio, and a network to draw on, really makes where you went to school irrelevant? At some point shouldn't your "work speak for itself?"

  49. oh and @ April 4, 2011 8:09 AM

    I actually laughed so hard at that it made coffee come out of my nose. That SMS bitch has a lot of balls putting that HE-SHE photo up. Ugly sucker that kimber. I sense that it might have weird looking tits...possibly square.

  50. That's if you can survive it, son. Since attending one of these toilet bowls will likely leave the hapless grad with little, more likely no, opportunity to train under anyone, such grads are forced to "do a Rakofsky" and just take cases on, hoping for the best. This is the modern model, and it's not a very good one for anyone. By all means, give it a whirl if you like. But it's a shitty game-plan rife with the spectre of future disciplinary actions and professinal complaints.

    And, make sure that malpractice premium is paid. You'll need it.

  51. Sorry.

    12:46 was in reference to 12:34.

  52. @ 12:43:

    I'll bet any money "NY hiring partner" is a law student or new grad?

  53. @12:34:

    You raise good points. BTW, nobody really talks or thinks like the law student posting as "NY hiring partner".

    The problem is that biglaw and small law create different skill sets which do not easily transfer into each other. Big law tends to deal in legally complex areas such as M&A, securities, antitrust, and intellectual property. Often these also entail a deep working knowledge of technology, finance or economics. Big law litigation is mostly federal and consists of excellent research and writing, review of documents, and discovery practice. The closest that you come to trial are depositions and oral arguments.

    Small law tends to deal mostly in factual disputes and real time questioning and far less in complex legal issues or review of documents. Small law practice areas are usually state court and involve criminal, personal injury, divorce and real estate.

    So if you are outside of biglaw, it's hard to get the skills and experience to lateral in. It is also hard to directly solicit clients because they are sophisticated corporations and won't be hustled by a novice with a Rakofsky type website.

    The opposite is also true. Big law drop outs rarely become outstanding PI, criminal or divorce lawyers; though it is much easier for bad lawyers to get clients here (look at Rakofsky).

    Biglaw makes more money than small law, ON AVERAGE. But there are exceptions to the average. Outstanding plaintiff's firm partners, who take cases on contingency, are richer than biglaw hourly rate partners.

    Outstanding small civil litigation firms can, with great effort, learn big law practice areas and become "boutiques".

    So moving up is not impossible, but very difficult.

    Work hard, and take pride in, whatever you do.

  54. Nando -- Aw, come on! You give Mr. Dyer too much credit there. He could not spade to save his life, which is why he got a "fluff" position on editorial staff for that journal. I believe he was the social director for the journal, no real work involved, no damage done someone else would have to undo. I would not be surprised if a judge somewhere is pointing and laughing at his feeble attempts to cite in correct Bluebook format. Even those old geezers know more about correct citations that Mr. Dyer does.

  55. Whether the punch thrown was a jab or a right hook, it certinly had the desired effect either way, look at the devestatiion it caused.


Web Analytics