Monday, August 29, 2011

Fourth Tier Pile of Fresh Waste: Elon University School of Law

Tuition: For the 2011-2012 school year, full-time students at Elon Univer$iTTTTy Sewer of Law will be charged $34,550 in tuition. So much for opening the doors of “the noble profession” to those of moderate incomes.

Total Cost of Attendance: The bitches and hobos estimate that housing, food, utilities, personal, transportation, health insurance, rental insurance, books and supplies, plus parking will add another $23,243 to the big-ass tab. This would bring the total COA - for the current school year - to $57,793.

Rest assured that the pigs only considered nine-month costs, when arriving at this figure. Taking twelve-month housing, food, utilities, personal, and transportation expenses into account, we reach a more accurate total, estimated COA of $64,292.

Ranking: Based on the prohibitive cost of tuition and overall attendance, this school must have one hell of a reputation, huh?!?! Well…according to US “News” & World Report, Elon University Sewer of Law is a fourth tier pile of dog feces. (Of course, Pussy Bob Morse now uses the phrase “Rank Not Published” to identify fourth tier dung piles.)

Supposed Employment Placement Statistics: The swamp pit claims that “89.7 percent of the members of Elon University School of Law's charter class were employed nine months after graduation.” Yeah, sure they were - and I just struck out the heart of the Yankees lineup on nine pitches. Then again, serving as bartender at Brewski’s Tavern, ringing up sales at PetSmart, and taking reservations for the Holiday Inn Express count as “employment.”

However, according to this chart from the two choirboys at Law School Transparency, only 81.3% of this commode’s Class of 2009 was employed, within nine months of graduation. Yet, the school wants prospective students to believe that its grads had better outcomes, while the overall job market shrunk further.

Average Law Student Indebtedness: USN&WR lists the average student indebtedness of Elon Univer$iTTTTy $chool of Law grads from the Class of 2010, who incurred law school debt, as $103,059. Incredibly, 91 percent of this particular class took on such toxic debt for their fourth tier law degree. To put this into perspective, third-ranked Stanford Law 2010 grads incurred - on average - $104,424, in law school debt. Furthermore, “only” 81 percent of Stanford JDs took on such debt.

Administrator and Faculty Salary Info: Head to page 32 of Elon University’s 2010 IRS Form 990, to see how well the swine are making out. There, you can see that founding dean and “professor of law emeritus” Leary Davis made $313,680 in TOTAL COMPENSATION, for the 2009 calendar year. Yes, this “educator” made $272,215 in base compensation; $13,625 in other reportable compensation; $19,600 in retirement and other deferred compensation; and $8,240 in nontaxable benefits.

He is not the only one to make a handsome living by “teaching” legal theory to potential future lawyers. George R. Johnson, Jr., current dean of the sewer of law, “earned” $261,403 in TOTAL COMPENSATION, whereas Jeffrey Kinsler made $221,800 in TOTAL COMPENSATION, for the same tax year. See how well “higher education” pays off?!?!

This pile of waste received full accreditation on June 10, 2011. Keep in mind, that one could purchase a double-wide trailer, install some bookshelves, running water and an internet connection - and likely receive ABA accreditation.

By the way, this fourth tier cess pool was established in 2006. Yes, this bodes well for current students and recent graduates, huh?!?! Remember, this sewage pit has a small, insignificant alumni base. Does anyone with an IQ above 45 think that these students have a shot in hell, when competing against in-state “rivals” at Duke and UNC-Chapel Hill?

Conclusion: This festering, overpriced stink pit is now in its sixth year of operation. Remember, you DO NOT NEED to incur an additional $100K-$135K in NON-DISCHARGEABLE debt, in order to earn a TTTT law degree. By the way, North Carolina is home to seven law schools. Do you think that there might be a glut of attorneys, in the state?! If this is the best school you can get into - and you absolutely MUST become a lawyer - then you should re-take the LSAT. Hopefully, you can get accepted into a real law school.


  1. Law students are ranked from first to last with no ties. Morse should do the same: rank all law schools from 1 to 342, or however many programs there are now. Who cares if their feelings are hurt. No more of these bullshit 26-way ties.

    1. Just so you're clear, only at second-tier (as in not T-14) law schools are students ranked numerically. If you're intent on drawing out comparisons based on law student rankings, you should be familiar with those processes.

  2. I am surprised that these types of schools are thriving in this economy. Are kids really that dense in throwing away their futures by enrolling in these third and fourth tier schools? Ok perhaps a handfull from each school will make it but those are some fucking harsh odds against you. I had never heard of this "school" before this morning. In fact, I thought Elon was a thinning hair treatment. I suppose Elon, the law school, and Elon the hair treatment have something in common. Both promise great results (i.e., a six figure job and a full head of hair) for a fee when in reality, the final result is anything but what was promised.

    Hiding or riding this recession in law school will only compound your problems. Sure it sucks to have a worthless liberal arts degree. However, why double down on your fucked fate?

  3. WTF man, this place makes Cooley seem like a good school.

  4. In the past NC was textiles, military bases, and agriculture; this is not the case today. Take a drive along the I-77 corridor and you will not see the old South. It is true that the Old South can still be seen in the far west of the state and around Goldburg NC. B of A really caused Charlotte NC to develop. Raleigh/ Durhman is moving away from tobacco to.

    I want to be clear; NC does not need the law schools it has. NC has a very liberal admission on motion provision. Further, the NC bar is moderately hard but straight forward.

  5. I love this blog. It's not merely repetition. It's a ritual.

  6. When you go to the Elon Law Toilet's website, the first thing you see is a big banner that says, "Elon Achieves ABA Full Approval."

    If Elon was an MLB team, its website might say, "Elon batter executes successful sacrifice bunt in 17-0 loss."

  7. rofl. David Gergen teaches there.

    But on a serious note, how many of you Loyola, Brooklyn, Seton Hall, NYLS folks wish you had taken a full ride at somewhere like Elon? At least then you wouldn't be in debt.

  8. I wouldn’t be hirin’ enny student of da law if he done be goin’ t’ dis them here over yonder piece a shit law college. But you don’s be walking away from The Colonel empty handed so t’ speak. Ya see. I’s got to thinking’ ‘bout some shit ‘n’ I’s done did ol’ comed up wit’ a li’l rhyme. Wanna hear it, hear it go.

    Oh shit. My old age be’s all catching up to meh, ‘n’ shit. I’s shouldsta got damn menshunned that y’alls oughts to be havin’ da mu’fuckin’ rhythm a Aerosmith’s Janies Got A Gun when you’s done be readin’ dis li‘l ol‘ melody.

    Bill Clinton’s got a gun
    He and Monica had lotsa fun
    Shoulda stuck it in her bung
    Don’t know how well he’s hung
    Monica has dark tresses
    She even saved the dress -
    The one with da president’s cum
    She swallowed and said ‘Yum’

    Yeah yeah yeah yeah

    Bill stuck a cigar in her snatch
    Chris Rock said ‘Ain’t no 20 yr old girls tryin’ to blow Orin Hatch’
    Kenneth Starr is a asshole too
    His balls is always blue
    Lewinski’s lucky mah ass was already dead
    Else I’da given her lotsa head
    And she coulda beat my meat
    As I slide The Colonel’s pecker along her feet

    Bill didn’t even return da favor
    Mah ass woulda enjoyed yer flavor
    The Colonel’s gettin’ down
    The Colonel’s goin’ t’ town!
    Yeah yeah yeah!

    C’mon and snap a leg. A good ol’ ‘Merican chickin leg, dat is. Peace out bitchezz. Grab yer ass a Pepsi and head on over to one o‘ mah many chickin ‘stablishments..

  9. In the original post Nando said this.
    "Keep in mind, that one could purchase a double-wide trailer, install some bookshelves, running water and an internet connection - and likely receive ABA accreditation."
    I'm left wondering if the ABA has recently lowered the standards. Didn't they use to require a fax-machine in addition to an internet connection, running water, bookshelves, and a double-wide?
    Also I'm seeing no mention of actual books, just shelves to possibly put books on.

  10. @ 8:53 AM

    " WTF man, this place makes Cooley seem like a good school."

    Let's not get too carried away here . . .

  11. "In fact, I thought Elon was a thinning hair treatment."


  12. According to Prof. Paul Campos, the real rate of full-time legal employment for recent law school grads, factoring in Tier One grads, is about 45%.

    For a recently-accredited stenchpit like Elon, operating in an area saturated with well-established law schools, I would generously predict that 15-20 percent score real lawyer jobs.

    I predict the following Elon grads will go on to an actual legal career: (1) the two or three grads with the highest GPAs; (2) the three or four best looking females; (3) three to five drooling morons who happen to be close blood relations to a federal judge or a US senator;(4) two or three grads who join their mom or dad’s well-established solo practice; (5) two or three jock types who are accepted as JAG corps officers in the US military; (6) one or two racial minorities, hired as cover by firms whose main clients are doing something particularly destructive to a minority community; and (7) maybe two or three others who, Forest Gump-like, happen to be in the right place at the right time.

  13. Isn't Elon a respected liberal arts college? What the hell are they doing with this turd of a law school?

  14. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

  15. Elon. Is that some sort of reverse acronym. NOLE could mean no legal employment. Why the fuck is this shithole charging more than $34,000 per year?

  16. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.


    1. Campbell University Wiggins School of Law (Buies Creek, NC)
    2. Charlotte School of Law (Charlotte, NC)
    3. Duke University School of Law (Durham, NC)
    4. Elon University School of Law (Greensboro, NC)
    5. North Carolina Central University School of Law (Durham, NC)
    6. University of North Carolina School of Law (Chapel Hill, NC)
    7. Wake Forest University School of Law (Winston-Salem, NC)

    The U.S. Census Bureau estimated North Carolina's poplulation to be 9,535,483. The data shows that the state's population grew by 18.5%, from 2000 to 2010. That is rather impressive. I'm sure the ABA will take this into account, when they look at approving another pile of waste law school in the state.

    Duke University School of Law is ranked as the 11th best school in the nation. Yet, even this top-flight law school must resort to gaming the employment ranking, via its "Bridge to Practice" program.

    "Since its creation in 2008, the program has helped students at the School of Law pursue careers after graduation, especially in public interest and government agencies, said Melinda Vaughn, executive director of communications for the law school.

    “As the economy has faltered, more students have needed assistance,” Vaughn said.

    For Duke law students who do not secure a job after graduation, the Bridge to Practice program can provide a solution.

    The program, which awards financial fellowships to students for between eight and 12 weeks of full-time work, is an effort to achieve of the law school’s goal to employ all of its graduates for at least nine months after graduation. The law school has met that goal five times in the past six years, according to an April news release. In addition, the public interest sector does not usually hire lawyers until they pass the bar exam, which most students do not achieve until after graduation."

    Yes, some students at this elite law school are unable to find work, after graduation. (Such JDs then must settle for public interest positions, where the school essentially pays agencies to hire them - for short-term employment.) Keep in mind that these students were among the very best, coming into law school. Their UGPAs and LSAT scores typically place them among the top 5% of overall law students, in their respective entering class. If you count those who were not accepted into any law school, the input numbers are even starker.

  18. It is also comical to see the school DISHONESTLY claim that this program stemmed from the "faltering economy." Take a look at what law professor Brian Tamanaha said about this system, back on June 13, 2010:

    "Law schools advertise deceptively high rates of employment and misleading income figures. Many graduates can’t get jobs. Many graduates end up as temp attorneys working for $15 to $20 dollars an hour on two week gigs, with no benefits. The luckier graduates land jobs in government or small firms for maybe $45,000, with limited prospects for improvement. A handful of lottery winners score big firm jobs.

    And for the opportunity to enter a saturated legal market with long odds against them, the tens of thousands newly minted lawyers who graduate each year from non-elite schools will have paid around $150,000 in tuition and living expenses, and given up three years of income. Many leave law school with well over $100,000 in non-dischargeable debt, obligated to pay $1,000 a month for thirty years.

    THIS DISMAL SITUATION WAS NOT CAUSED BY THE CURRENT RECESSION—which merely spread the pain up the chain into the lower reaches of elite schools. This has been going on for years." [Emphasis mine]

    The fact is that the lawyer job market has been GROSSLY OVERSATURATED for years, even decades. The "recession" exacerbated the effects of the fundamental restructuring of the American economy. Now, higher-ranking schools are being affected by the following: ABA policies regarding outsouring; states now allowing non-lawyers to engage in the limited practice of law; advances in legal program software; easier layman access to case law, city ordinances and state statutes; etc.

    Take a look at the number of law grads from 1980-1981 to 2008-2009. In the span of 29 years, a cumulative total of 1,127,235 law degrees were awarded by ABA-accredited law schools. Yes, ONE MILLION, ONE HUNDRED AND TWENTY-SEVEN THOUSAND, TWO HUNDRED AND THIRTY FIVE law degrees have been issued in the last 29 years, in the United States. (For $ome rea$on, this link appears to be broken.)

    Mouthpiece Melinda Vaughn, "executive director of communications," should have said "The legal job market has been putrid for decades, for most law grads. The "recession" - coupled with political factors and advances in technology and softare - has resulted in a rougher job market for students and graduates of top law schools." Then again, Melinda the Shill knows that she can be replaced for speaking the truth. Aren't these "institutions of higher learning" so ethical and honorable?!?!

  19. For all you Elon grads, all I can do is laugh as a 20 yr practitioner in NC. With our draconian contrib law and the recently passed "billed v. paid" statute, your chances of being a successful lawyer from a shit school just evaporated. As someone who went to a 4th tier crapper and got in when things were good, I wouldnt dare go to law school now. I have had my own PI practice for 15 years and with these new rules all of us small firm practitioners sit around and laugh at the new grads while wondering how we are going to survive. You could get rich doing PI in this state but with the new rules that take place 10-1, forget it.

    Those of us with experience and good referral base are in panic as the gates are closing because those in power want law practice to return to being an elite profession so they need to put the ambulance chasers and non elite school grads out of business, especially those who are not UNC Wake or Duke grads. Oh they will keep pumping out the grads from crap schools as those with fancy degrees who cant handle private practice or are too white to get a gvt job need a place to earn their elite money, but whats next NC A and T law? At some point, it becomes pointless and you kids who are not from rich families are so fucked. Get off the train and start over doing anything else. That hot chick who dates you because you have law potential will leave you when you go to Elon or when you graduate and cant find a job. Even if you do get lucky you will end up postponing marriage and family to pay off the debt and the longer you wait to marry, the fewer decent options you have. I know.

    As for those of you going to start out doing court appointed work, I think the hourly rate is now down to $50.00 in NC and that is before the asshole Judge cuts your hours.

    To go to a school like Elon is beyond stupidity. Atleast the Central grads pay less in tuition.

    Best of luck idiots.

  20. @8/29/11 8:53PM: People tend to forget that Y Gen is pretty much raised by the Boomer Generation and the rules which applied to the Boomer's when they were in their 20's and 30's (as in just graduate from any college and you are marketable), simply do not apply to today. I can only site my 22 y/o cousin as a perfect example of the typical Boomer parent mentality. My 22 y/o cousin’s father managed to graduate from a 4T UGC, but was able to market himself a sales job in the telecommunications industry and do quite well for himself. The father insisted on his son going to his Alma Marta (which has an even worse reputation now) because he was able to do well (circa 1980) after graduating from a low ranked UGC. Many Boomers just simply cannot grasp that the world, and the US for that matter, are very different places right now. In fact the tides of change with school ranking actually started to happen during the 90’s when more and more colleges started to open its doors and the Federal Reserve took a more active role in giving out student loans to anyone with a pulse who went to college.

    Boomers also had the advantage in not having to work with multiple generations as Gen X'ers and Y Gens now have to. A majority of the Silent Generation was able to retire, therefore opening the doors for Boomers to get promoted. Not so easy for Gen X to climb up the corporate ladder, and it will even be more difficult for Y Gen to climb the same corporate ladder. We are however still dealing with 40 + years of being brainwashed that a degree will open the doors of opportunity because at one time, a degree was actually able to help market people better job opportunities. Those days are over folks. People have to be smart with their money and understand that a student loan has to be paid back -- no matter what.

  21. Knut writes of repetition; all I can say is burn the law schools down, shoot all the instructors, stop the madness now.

    I've written that before; I'll probably write it again.

    Nando, did you finally burn out WTLS? If so, well done.

    I like your chicken Coin'el; if I can't make my own, I buy yours.

  22. Strelnikov gets it. You need to shoot all these fucks in the head at close range and burn the law schools down to the ground.

  23. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.


    This guy is clearly not getting laid.

    Time Visitor Session
    Aug 30 2011 5:35pm 5 actions 13m 50s
    Aug 30 2011 9:35am 1 action 10s
    Aug 29 2011 9:31pm 1 action 10s
    Aug 29 2011 9:04pm 4 actions 13m 38s
    Aug 29 2011 7:59pm 5 actions 2m 20s
    Aug 25 2011 12:04pm 4 actions 20m 8s
    Aug 22 2011 4:03pm 2 actions 16s
    Aug 22 2011 3:24pm 1 action 10s
    Aug 22 2011 1:59pm 8 actions 37m 21s
    Aug 22 2011 1:39pm 2 actions 1m 13s
    Aug 22 2011 9:22am 2 actions 31s
    Aug 22 2011 8:52am 2 actions 10m 18s
    Aug 22 2011 4:52am 2 actions 8m 12s
    Aug 21 2011 3:44pm 1 action 1m
    Aug 21 2011 2:27pm 2 actions 1m 12s
    Aug 21 2011 1:42pm 1 action 10m 2s
    Aug 21 2011 12:46pm 2 actions 1m 6s
    Aug 21 2011 11:57am 4 actions 7m 2s
    Aug 21 2011 8:49am 2 actions 12m 37s
    Aug 18 2011 11:58am 1 action 10s
    Aug 17 2011 4:46pm 2 actions 2m 14s

    By the way, bitch, the diploma mills prefer to keep the sub-par students enrolled. Students who are earning low grades are typically not receiving scholarship or grant money to attend law school. In fact, law schools work on those students - and inform them that if they stick through it, they will come out better. Deans and professors will often talk those students into “staying the course.”

    I saw this at my own school, and JDs and lawyers from other “in$titution$ of higher learning” have related those stories on other legal blogs. The schools cynically feed off of the pride and ego of their pupils, i.e. “You don’t want to be a quitter.”

    The fact remains that such law students would be better served by dropping out, once they receive their first semester grades. Here is former Biglaw associate, and current psychotherapist, Will Meyerhofer’s views on quitting law school:

    “Does this mean I’m seriously advising young law students all over the country to give up and drop out – simply abandon their legal education mid-way through?

    I am prescribing a mass exodus from law schools. A semi-mass exodus might do the trick.

    Tune in. Turn on. Drop out.

    If you don’t know why you’re there – and you’re not sure what you’re getting yourself into – if you’re not at a top school, or even if you are, and your grades are a little iffy, and likely to stay that way – then please, get out. Today. Before you spend another cent.”

  25. Nando,
    Seriously, you're all into posting school's IRS Form 990's as if profs make some ridic salary at every school, which simply isn't the case (costs of living vary widely) though I would think that living in NC is cheaper than Chicago, LA, etc.

  26. What the hell is an Elon?

  27. Yes. Perhaps THE biggest mistake, kids, is in seeing this unwarranted disaster through to fruition by continuing on in a non-elite law school after a poor showing of First Year grades. Barring significant and valuable experiences, contacts and connections, this is most likely your biggest mistake.

    This phenomenon of students going on auto-pilot and "sticking it out" through second and third year is what I have dubbed "The Law School Death March." It leads, for most, to nowhere but financial and social ruin, for others, it is the path to their parents' basement, and a few will survive soloing perhaps.

    This practice of "sticking it out" is a remnant of another era in which higher education ALWAYS paid off and from a generation's experiences in the past resulting from a very temporary set of circumstances known as Post-Workd War Two prosperity. That is why the early Boomers thought themselves to be hitting a triple when they were in fact born on third. The set of conditions we are NOW experiencing is I am afraid the new normal.

  28. Where is NYC Hiring Partner guy?

    Time to check in.

  29. Its sad to think that there are almost certainly people out there who were happy when they found out that they were admitted to Elon and all the other TT-TTTT crappers. I remember how impressed others were, and what a bigshot I felt like when I was about to go to my TT commode.

    I am convinced that a good number of law lemmings enter law school simply because it sounds so impressive to say "I am going to law school." Other people around you are almost always impressed by the fact that you are going to law school. I believe that many lemmings have the idea that law school is like a big, magic eraser that will take away their personal shortcomings and leave them as better, stronger, more attractive people when it is done.

    It is not. Law school is more like the person who, when you first meet them, gets you as a person, understands you, validates you, tells you everything you want to hear about yourself and makes you feel great. Its only later that this person has drained your bank account, run up your credit cards, appropriated your car, and then blames you for everything.

    Make no mistake. Law schools do not care about you as a person. All they want is your warm carcass in a seat for three years paying tuition. They do not give a crap what happens to you after you graduate. They will not follow up to see how things are going for you. If you are selling plasma to keep the lights turned on while paying your mountain of loan debt, they are not interested. They are concerned with the next group of lemmings that has to be fleeced.

    If you are in law school because you think it will fix some deficient part of your personality, or because you think that being in law school makes you look important, but you are not 100% certain about what you are going to do when you graduate, do the smart thing and drop out. The 100k or 200k of debt is not worth it to chase some fantasy that law school will make you complete as a person. It won't.

  30. I felt proud when I got my acceptance letter. Now I realize I should've paid attention to the surplus of lawyers before I went to law school. Now I see starving lawyers on the bus all the time. Why go to all that trouble, the debt, just to squeak by?

  31. @ Aug, 31, 12:15 PM pretty much sums it all up.

    All I can add are details about the lifetime misery.

  32. This blog has opened my eyes and shown me new depths of law school mediocrity. Two years ago, a resume from an applicant who graduated from this school made its way to my desk. I saw the word "Elon" and I thought "oh God, not another douchebag that went to a school in France." Little did I know there is an actual law school named Elon right here in the states. Well at least it's not called Elongated because I cannot fathom anyone's legal career going the distance from the toilet paper they dispense as a diploma from this school.

    I am tired of saying what is patently obvious. If kids are blind and dumb, let them mortgage their freedom and futures on this scam.

    I have been reading the lawprof's blog. Some solid entries but remember, he is living off of the backs of the new indentured class. I am sure he is working on a law review type article which highlights the scam only to advance his academic career. Be wary of his intentions.

    NYC Hiring Partner

    1. Okay Harvey Specter, the sad thing is as a "NYC hiring partner" you are dumb enough to make such accusations blindly.

      "Little did I know there was an actual law school...the toilet paper they dispense as a diploma from this school."

      Send me your address so I can swing by, drop off my resume, and wipe my ass with your diploma.

    2. It is ok. I won't work for you either. /patentattny

  33. Law School: The Three Year Arc From Estasy to Misery.

    Has a nice ring to it.

  34. Nando. Great post again but how do you find the energy and will to engulf yourself in blogging about this revolting and miserable field? It's too much for me. I started following teh scamblog movement once scamprof started blogging, but it's depressing as hell. Although it's all 100% factual and true and I appreciate you devoting your time to exposing the truth in the hopes of helping save people, I'm not sure I could have the fighting will to do it.

    Good for you Nando.


    “Welcome to the Center for Engaged Learning in the Law, affectionately known as CELL.

    This site is intended to serve as a nexus for law teachers, students, administrators and practitioners to share different perspectives on how learning can be improved in law schools.

    The aim is to promote and communicate advances in legal education with these constituencies. Subjects leading to improved learning can be as diverse as advice for newer teachers and students, direct prescriptions for improvement, inspirational quotes or narratives and how to find satisfying jobs in the law.

    Please click here to tell us what you think of the site. Your feedback is always appreciated!

    CELL News

    CELL sponsors lecture by Justice Brennan biographer Stephen Wermeil

    On October 28, Stephen Wermiel, coauthor of Justice Brennan: Liberal Champion, spoke with Elon Law students and faculty about his new book, which gives unprecedented access into the life of William J. Brennan, Jr., considered by many to be the most influential Supreme Court justice of the twentieth century. Click here to listen to Wemiel's lecture at Elon Law and to read more about his insights into the life and work of Justice Brennan.”

    Yes, this center will definitely help Elon Univerity Sewer of Law grads become skilled legal practitioners, right?!?! Then again, considering that many of this toilet’s grads will return to teaching grade school or selling insurance, I suppose these (pointless) lectures, academic panels and seminars will provide these students with some sense of intellectual nourishment.

    “The Center for Law and Humanities is committed to the interdisciplinary study of law in concert with the fundamental humanistic principles that underpin Western theories of justice. The scholars affiliated with the Center work to bring critical intellectual tools from the humanistic disciplines to bear on the law in order to understand the evolution of the law, measure the effect of legal developments on society, and explore possible futures for the law emerging from humanistic principles. The Center will invite scholars, legal practitioners, and policymakers of note to speak to the community at large on topics at the intersection of law, humanities, and society. It will also pursue legal and scholarly ventures that further its goals of encouraging critical interdisciplinary study of the law, including periodically publishing scholarly papers, encouraging public discussion of important legal issues, and advancing graduate and undergraduate student research in law and humanities.”

    When one has a JD, he essentially has earned an advanced degree in humanities. By the way, politics, money and power are the bases of Western “ju$tice.”

    1. At least this center is doing something interdisciplinary, linking with other areas of academic thought that might make attorneys useful in some other integrated field and not just in the narrow, rather corrupt field that we all seem to be strongly attacking, largely for a good reason. Three years of law school are in no way an advanced degree in humanities.

  36. Would the colonel hire someone from the Center for Law and Humanities?

  37. Not that I can speak for the esteemed Colonel, of course, but I suppose one can never have too much ejumacation to man the deep fryer.

  38. Wow. Elon has a Center for Law and Humanities AND a Center for Engaged Learning in the Law.

    Its bad enough that people go to law school to get an extra degree to try to dress up their useless BA in the humanities. Its worse that a law school that issues useless JDs has to dress up its own sad image by having Centers for Law and Humanities and for Engaged Learning in the Law.

    This is something like going on a date and beginning things by saying, "I have chronic bad breath and poor social skills and a bad bladder control problem and I live in mom's basement, but I will have you know that my socks are very clean."

  39. After attending a school like Elon for law, one may very well indeed end up living in Mom's basement.

    Now that there are, by my conservative estimate, more ABA-accredited law schools in America than Waffle House franchises, this phenomenon will be inescapable for many.

  40. Tacking on a "Center for Law and Humanities" to this school's curriculum is like spraying Chanel on a toothless crackwhore: you can spend the money but somehow the desired effect just does not occur...

  41. These centers are bullshit. They don't teach students how to practice. They don't add to the degree (other than in cost). They don't teach anything practical. And they don't make you any more marketable.

    What's the point? To enrich the schools even more.

  42. BTW - Sonya Garza is a giant cunt.

  43. why didnt you post this before I accepted and decided to go....

  44. I am a 3L at Elon Law currently. I received a full tuition scholarship. It is in fact a very fine school. The students are active and engaged. Most grads I know from '11 and '10 are working now. I'm not sure what all the negativity is for.

    1. I am a parent of an Elon Law Grad...and one day soon I shall enter into this blogbate and clearly articulate what I think about this university, its PR machine, its costs, and the irrelevant "Centers-of-?" so kindly proffered up to help them sell this place...right now I am just #1 - Ticked-off that I didn't find this blog BEFORE sending a great kid, with a real heart for JUSTICE, to them for utter ruination and #2 - Ticked-off that the great kid I sent to them came back not only broke, but broken down and beaten up by some of the most loathesome, pit slithering vipers...nevermind still too angry to type another descriptive phrase...DO NOT ENCOURAGE ANYONE YOU CARE ABOUT TO ATTEND ELON UNIVERSITY'S LAW SCHOOL whether they get some hoity-toity free full tuition or not! If only I could turn back the clock...

    2. Maybe you should have taught your child how to grow a backbone. Do you know what else describes "the most loathesome, pit slithering vipers"? It's 90% of practicing lawyers and the institutions that hold them up. The system is built on a "do it this way because that's how I did it when I was learning" mentality that quickly latches onto and attacks any attempt at innovation.

      I'm familiar with this institution and the kind of students coming out of it and it's up to those individual students to make their own name and do well with their time there and guess what - if you spend more than 60% of your time in law school focusing on law school, you're missing out on other skills and other networking and other opportunities that you'll need to succeed after graduation. That said I don't think it's remotely worth what they charge for tuition.

      If your kid came back broken down, he wouldn't last very long as a lawyer so it's probably for the best.

    3. Elon accepts the lower class in as servants in exchange for tuition. This is where full tuition came in. This person is not cut from Elon cloth. Everyone at Elon knows, Elon law is a joke. Weaver is not Elon.

  45. 95%+ of all the grads from all the law schools in NC don't have a hard science degree that lets them take the patent bar, or more than a year of quality work experience.


  46. Elon is a fourth tier piece of shit.

  47. Elon was EVERYONE"S safety school 25 years ago - they were known for accepting you even if you just listed them as a school to send your SATs too... our guidance counselor always made us list a safety.

    But something happened and boy did they start cranking it out. Jumped up to D1 in sports, starting investing in football and huge building projects. Pushed the law school deal through - of course it isn't even in the same city as Elon is.

    Those of who are local just laugh. I mean if you need a break and can't get into UNC or Duke, you go to Campbell (meh) or do the part-time deal at NC Central (the only pt option in NC).

    Truthfully the NC Central model is what Elon should have done - try to become a solid law school with a non-traditional student. At least there is some merit in that, as opposed to what they are doing.

  48. I feel confident in stating Elon is the worst managed law school in North Carolina, and if any school in this state fails, it will be them.

  49. If the rumors are true, Elon finished next-to-last in North Carolina in the July bar exam, beating only Charlotte. So their students are paying over $32,000.00 a year in tuition to get an education that can't even compete with North Carolina Central.

  50. The students at Elon Law are starting to wake up. The rising 3L class is down to approximately 80 students, after starting with 110. I can only assume those that transferred out have accepted the reality that a law degree from Elon pales in comparison to other options in the state, and are getting out as fast as possible. From what I hear, Wake Forest and Campbell are the hottest destination for those who have the grades necessary to get out.

  51. Yesterday, Elon Law fired the Dean of Admissions, Dean of Student Affairs, and the head of Career Services. Unfortunately, the incompetent faculty who lead to their current problems are still employed.

  52. If Leo weren't so damn determined to have that law school (and all the other new graduate schools opened during his tenure) to cement his legacy as the prez who took Elon from a tiny college of fighting Christians to a premier University, that pile of waste would be shuttering its doors within a year or two.

  53. If Leo weren't so determined to cement his legacy as the prez who took a tiny college of Fighting Christians to a premier University with a million graduate programs, this soon-to-be money-bleeding pile of garbage would be shuttering its doors within a couple years.

  54. In addition to firing all the staff from admissions, Elon has taken another ridiculous step and hired two recent (unemployed or underemployed) graduates. Two women who are very nice on a personal level, but have never worked a day in the academic world, have magically been given director positions. I guess this is another way for Elon to pump up job placement statistics.

  55. In the July 2014 bar exam, Elon managed to squeeze out a lousy 61.18 percent passage rate, making them next-to-last in the state. $40,000.00 a year in tuition for a school that, once again, finished lower than NCCU (65.04 passage rate).

  56. Elon announced a new price scheme yesterday. They're cutting the cost of tuition by $14,000.00 annually, and are allowing students to graduate in 2.5 years instead of 3. They're working hard to firmly establish themselves as the T.J. Maxx of legal education. I'd be furious if I was student who just graduated, having spent almost $40,000.00 a year on tuition for a fourth tier education, particularly now that the school has acknowledged the services they were offering weren't worth the price.

  57. As an update to that last post, it turns out Elon only cut $14,000.00 off their total price (it used to cost $114,000.00 to attend the school for three years). Now, it will cost a mere $100,000.00 to attend a bottom tier school with a 61 percent bar passage rate.

  58. Elon had a 44.78% passage rate on the July 2016 bar exam. Thanks to them (and Charlotte), the average for the whole state was pulled down to 56.94%.

  59. Elon had a 44% bar passage rate for the July 2017 exam. The only lower passage rate in the state was from the (now defunct) Charlotte School of Law.


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