Sunday, March 25, 2012

Profiles in Judicial Excrement: Corporate Shill “Judge” Melvin L. Schweitzer


Cockroach Judge Dismissed the Class Action Against Third Tier Trash Pit New York Law $chool:

http://abovethelaw.com/2012/03/breaking-class-action-lawsuit-against-new-york-law-school-dismissed/

On March 21, 2012, ATL’s Staci Zaretsky reported on this development, in a piece labeled “BREAKING: Class Action Lawsuit Against New York Law School Dismissed.” Check out the following excerpts: 

“Here’s one of [Melvin] Schweitzer’s money quotes:

The court does not view these post-graduate employment statistics to be misleading in a material way for a reasonable person acting reasonably. By anyone’s definition, reasonable consumers - college graduates - seriously considering law schools are a sophisticated subset of education consumers, capable of sifting through data and weighing alternatives before making a decision regarding their post-graduate options, such as applying to professional school. These reasonable consumers have available to them any number of resources of information to review when making a decisions.”

I laugh when oversensitive lemmings make disparaging comments about my writing style. It is lucid and straightforward. Perhaps, these waterheads confuse the ridiculous run-on sentences and mixture of corporatese, edu-babble, fifth rate social commentary and legal jargon, i.e. garbage, employed by “judges”/politicians in black robes as actual communication skills. If your child, as a high school student, wrote about “a reasonable person acting reasonably,” you should consider sending him to an “alternative school” - where he can gain better instruction and individual attention.

The piece continued:

"And here’s another one. Apparently Schweitzer, much like William Robinson III of the ABA, thinks it’s inconceivable that the plaintiffs suing NYLS weren’t aware of the declining market for legal jobs:

It is also difficult for the court to consider that somehow lost on these plaintiffs is that a goodly number of law school graduates toil (perhaps part-time) in drudgery or have less than hugely successful careers. NYLS applicants, as reasonable consumers of a legal education, would have to be wearing blinders not to be aware of these well-established facts of life in the world of legal employment.” [Emphasis mine]

Let me take a moment to shove that idiotic straw man “argument” up your old, corroded ass, Melvin. Law grads typically are not expecting HUGELY SUCCESSFUL careers. Most simply want to be able to put food in the fridge, provide their own living expenses, and pay their monthly bills - including their NON-DISCHARGEABLE student loan debt. Do…you…understand…that,…Bitch?!?! Or do I need to explain this to you in moronic terms, such as a concoction of academic/technical language, psycho-babble and corporate jargon?!

This case was quickly tossed out - despite the standard for dismissal being relatively high. Anyone without a personal bias or stake in the matter - who is also armed with a shred of honesty and a decent understanding of the issue - realizes that the documentary evidence DOES NOT utterly refute the plaintiffs’ factual allegations. As such, this case should be decided by finders of fact. Of course, the Melvin wants to ensure that a jury does not hear this controversy. (This certainly does not mean that the plaintiffs would win.) In the end, what can you expect from a garbage industry? Deans and university presidents are friends with legislators, judges and the upper crust segment of U.S. society. These pigs have a shared interest in making sure that the general public buys into the judicial and "higher education" systems.

Background on the Pig Known as Melvin Schweitzer:

http://www.nycourts.gov/courts/comdiv/newyork_bio_Schweitzer.shtml

From Melvin’s bio, as provided by the New York State Supreme Court, i.e. trial court:

"Melvin L. Schweitzer received his bachelor’s degree with honors from New York University’s University College of Arts and Sciences in 1966, and his juris doctor in 1969 from Fordham University School of Law, where he was a Loyal League Philanthropies scholar and a member of the Fordham National Moot Court Team.

From 1969-2005, he was in private practice, focusing on corporate, securities, public finance and insurance law, thirty years with Rogers & Wells in New York City. [Emphasis mine]

Melvin SchweiTTTzer graduated from law school in 1969. The legal job market has changed a little since then, correct?!?! Clearly, someone who practiced corporate law is going to side with business enterprises. This is human nature. For instance, trial court judges who were prosecutors identify with the assistant district attorneys and police.

Others Weigh In on Pig Schweitzer’s Decision:

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/education/disgruntled-york-law-school-grads-day-court-lawsuit-dismissed-article-1.1048963?localLinksEnabled=false

From the March 22, 2012 article from Barbara Ross and the New York Daily News entitled “Disgruntled New York Law School grads have their day in court…but the lawsuit is dismissed”:

“YOU SHOULD have known your law degree was a dud.

That’s the message Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Melvin Schweitzer sent to nine recent New York Law School grads when he dismissed their lawsuit claiming their alma mater misled them about job prospects.”

http://insidethelawschoolscam.blogspot.com/2012/03/myth-of-sophisticated-law-student.html

Check out this March 22nd entry from Paul Campos, under the headline “The myth of the sophisticated law student”:

“Judge Schweitzer is living in the comfortable fantasy world of "rational actors," where reasonable people decide on reasonable courses of action in a reasonably reasonable way. Out in the real world, "the market" for places in law school consists in large part of inexperienced, unworldly, non-cynical, irrepressibly optimistic young people who have been socialized successfully to believe that law school personnel operate by a more exalted code than that found among carnival barkers and used car salesmen. In other words, people who have not yet learned to "think like a lawyer," i.e., a cynical pessimist who takes it for granted that

(a) In an "arms-length" transaction somebody is going to try to rip you off at least up to the very limits of the law, if not well beyond it; and

(b) Everything is an arms-length transaction.” [Emphasis mine]

Conclusion: In the final analysis, Melvin Schweitzer is a corporate hack, and a tool of the establishment. Hell, the piece of garbage was a corporate and securities lawyer for over three decades. What can you expect from such trash? He clearly identifies with business entities, including independent business enterprises masquerading as "institutions of higher education.

By the way, Melvin: TONS of college graduates are not fully aware that student debt is not dischargeable in bankruptcy. When I mention this to such people, they often look incredulous.  So much for college grads being "sophisticated consumers," Ass-Wipe. Furthermore, 22 year old Americans are optimistic when it comes to their futures - and they also typically do not question authority figures or social institutions, especially “well-meaning” colleges and universities. They have been raised - since infancy - to believe that “Higher education is the KEY to their success.” This message has been reinforced by parents, teachers throughout K-12, peers, extended family members, pastors, movies and TV. You need to get out more, if you actually subscribe to the blithering nonsense in your order granting NYL$’s motion to dismiss.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-57393849/even-lawyers-struggle-to-find-jobs-these-days

Take a look at this segment from Chip Reid and CBS Evening News, which aired on March 8, 2012. Don’t worry, Melvin. It consists of a 2:23 video, and you will not be required to do much thinking or any reading. The piece is entitled “Lean times for law school grads.” Ask recent NYL$ grad Kevin Johnson how well this TTT worked out for him, you mental midget. According to this broadcast, Johnson graduated in the top 25% of his class. Head to the 0:33 mark of this link, you intellectually lazy bastard - and listen to Johnson’s words:

“Lawyers do lawyer things. Lawyers work in law firms. Lawyers do public policy work. Lawyers don’t serve pizza.”

57 comments:

  1. Nando wrote:

    "They have been raised - since infancy - to believe that “Higher education is the KEY to their success.” This message has been reinforced by parents, teachers throughout K-12, peers, extended family members, pastors, movies and TV."

    That says it all.

    No one was raised to see Higher Education or Law School as a gamble with devastatingly high stakes.

    For Example, there was a TV commercial a few years back showing African American Students standing up or rising at a College Commencement ceremony while the voice of Maya Angelou read her famous poem: "Still I rise"

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  2. You people are such pathetic whiners. Yeah big deal, the law school's promotional materials had some statistics which were misleading. Aren't you supposed to be FUTURE LAWYERS? Can't you fucking figure out if some advertisement is true or not true? Do some research and ask around.

    Besides, New York Law School is ranked near the bottom of all law schools. If you have no idea that going there for law school might not lead to you being a high-flying biglaw partner then you deserve to be in debt. Consider it a stupidity tax.

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  3. 9:26--"Big deal, the law school's promotional materials had some statistics which were misleading." Could you briefly describe your ethical code? I don't care about whether or not you believe in God, Allah or any other "higher" being; I just want to know what your sense of right and wrong includes. Perhaps you could help me to understand why it's OK to lie to people or to manipulate facts in a way that takes advantage of the people in question. Really, I want to know how one can rationalize that: In the end, I'm a humanist and I therefore want to understand people.

    Nando and JD--You said it all. Thanks!

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  4. Dona: Ok, you got me. It's wrong to put misleading (but technically true) information in promotional materials. But this is what lawyers do for a living. They stand up in court and try to manipulate facts in their favor. And the "scammed" students are perfectly aware of that. Then they act all shocked that the law schools were manipulating data. It might be wrong to mislead people, which is what lawyers do constantly, but it's also wrong to pretend you had no idea that you wouldn't be rolling in money and job offers after graduated. And if you really did have no idea despite common sense and all the evidence around you, then you're too stupid/naive to become a lawyer anyhow and should go into social work or something.

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  5. No you cannpot recall this pig. New York has no mechanism to recall Acting Supreme Court Judges (NY Supreme Court Judges are the lowest of general jurisdiction trial court judge) and he isn't even a "real" Supreme Court Judge.... just an "acting" sludge.

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  6. As a native New Yorker who attended college and law school in the area, it was common knowledge to most 21 and 22 year olds that NYLS is a horrible law school which lacked a good reputation. NYLS was considered a law school where retired cops or part-time students could get an affordable law degree. This was over 20 years ago when NYLS tuition was substantially lower than NYU, Columbia and Fordham. Now NYLS costs as much, if not more than these higher ranked schools. NYLS never had a reputation for being a Biglaw feeder. Sure, maybe a handful of connected or top NYLS grads get sprinkled in Biglaw each year but a college student should not extrapolate from this that an NYLS JD is a good bet.

    I think Judge Schweitzer was prejudiced by this perspective, which he acquired by virtue of practicing law for decades in NYC. In other words, if you live or work in NYC, it is common knowledge, even on the street, that NYLS is full of shit when it comes to its employment stats. A McDonald's double quarter pounder with cheese may state the calories it contains yet it doesn' mean it is healthy for you. Yet billions of these quarter pounders are sold every year. People will continue to make dumb decisions regardless of what is out there. Do I agree with the Judge's decision? No, I think there is a lot of politics and money at stake here. NYLS is too protected if you know what I mean. Look at its Board of Trustees. Who really owns NYLS. Make the connection with NY politics. The shyster team of Anziska/Strauss never stood a chance. Another hint that the decision was bullshit was its length. Whenever you have a TRIAL level court author an opinion more than 10 pages, you know the court is trying to cover its ass for a potential appeal. The judge knew he was wrong but he tried justifying his decision by throwing all these fallacious arguments. I hope the decision gets appealed but don't expect the NY Ct. of Appeals to sympathize with the NYLS class plaintiffs. This case is about beating the little guy by stonewalling him/her throughout the process.

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  7. Sucha a shame. I do hope plaintiffs' counsel files an appeal. Any entity which exagerates or lies about stats, caveat emptor argument loses its credence.

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  8. Doesn't the question of reasonable reliance require factual determinations, and isn't that alone enough for a lawsuit to survive a motion to dismiss?

    Or does Judge Schweizter think that fraud is categorically impossible to commit against college grads because college grads are just so sophisticated?

    Lawsuits are still pending in 19 other cases and I hope the judges in those cases have enough integrity to reject Schweitzer's disgraceful blame-the-victim assumptions.

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  9. "[T]his is what lawyers do for a living. They stand up in court and try to manipulate facts in their favor..."

    If your understanding of what lawyers do is this pathetic and devoid of ethics, how are you fit to comment on the issue?

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  10. What 11:14 said. This asshole wrote a 38 page decision on a fucking motion to dismiss. That's a giant red flag.

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  11. You know what, Nandster, I'm not defending this cunt but he might have given law schools a backhanded "fuck you!" The judge - who is an authority-figure within the Establishment - said in an official judicial opinion that many law grads end up in shitty jobs, and that people must be fucking retarded not to know this. And isn't this exactly what scamblogging is all about? Telling people that lots of law grads end up in shitty jobs, and that they are retarded if they believe the official stats?

    I'm 90% sure this judge made the wrong decision by dismissing this suit, but by doing so, he may well have gone on the record as someone in a position of relative success telling people how shitty law grads' opportunities are. And whatever people say about scambloggers ("disgruntled"), they can't say that about a sitting fucking judge with no ax to grind on this issue.

    I'd like to know your thoughts on this. Again, I'm 90% sure the guy is an Establishment cunt, but maybe there's more to this than meets the eye. Perhaps the headline shouldn't be "Jackoff Judge Misses the Point!", and should be "Bench Tells Prelaws That Law School is a FUCKING SCAM!"

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  12. I think you are attacking the wrong person here. The real people to blame are the plaintiffs' attorneys. Have you read their complaints? They have done an awful job so far. They need more details on how the students were defrauded. They need to do more research. They certainly shouldn't be filing more complaints. They should concentrate on a few very bad schools and stop with the shotgun approach. A decent attorney should never lose a motion to dismiss.

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  13. @2:35PM

    Good Point. On the one hand New York Law School must be relieved that the case was dismissed.

    On the other, they are probably a little chagrined that the Judge said, in so many words, that NYLS is a risky endeavor.

    So maybe that can be seen as a tiny victory, although it doesn't amount to anything.

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  14. @ 2:35

    "......but maybe there's more to this than meets the eye......."

    No, there's less to this than meets the eye.

    This is a wrong judge for the case not to mention that Plaintiffs' lawyers have no name or standing in the legal community. I cannot call either of them a shyster, as I do not know both of them. However, they both a sole practitioners that I ready to take on any case that comes through the door.

    In my opinion, unless and until an established lawyer with stellar reputation from a brand name law firm is going to take over these files, there will be very little success. But even these two lawyers can do a much better job, and they do, they will eventually prevail in a court of a right judge. These are solid cases.

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  15. This comes down to pure fucking greed. Nothing more. And the cocksucker made sure to cover his tracks with a nearly 40 page decision. Finally someone calling a spade a spade.

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  16. To the cretin who posted at 9:26 am and 10:18 am,

    http://ip-whois-lookup.com/lookup.php?ip=69.209.55.176

    How is life in Chicago, bitch?!?! Why are YOU whining about a valid critique of Pig Schweitzer’s decision?! What is your stake in the matter, dung beetle? Do you want to see more law students and grads put through the meat grinder, you sick, stupid bastard?

    Visits: 9
    Unique ID: 3806755814
    IP address: 69.209.55.176
    Locale: Chicago, IL, USA / English
    Platform: Internet Explorer 8.0 / Windows 7 / 1366x768

    Mar 25 2012 3:40pm 69.209.55.176 1 action 10s
    Mar 25 2012 1:15pm 69.209.55.176 2 actions 5s
    Mar 25 2012 12:12pm 69.209.55.176 2 actions 6s
    Mar 25 2012 11:12am 69.209.55.176 1 action 10s
    Mar 25 2012 10:09am 69.209.55.176 3 actions 9m 1s
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    Mar 25 2012 7:42am 69.209.55.176 1 action 10s

    Look at your activity on this blog today, cockroach. If the ABA pigs - based out of Chicago - put you up to this, then you should consider finding another job. Your self-respect, dignity and integrity SHOULD be worth more than a mere paycheck. Perhaps your mother didn’t mind spreading her legs for thousands of strange men, at $10-$15 a pop, but you should hold yourself to a higher standard, moron. Unless, of course, you actually enjoy being a pathetic whore.

    By the way, lawyers who gain a reputation for dishonesty are considered lower than rat feces, by judges, firms, agencies and opposing counsel. (Remember, when writing a brief or arguing a motion in court, you are not permitted to intentionally distort a case or statute, when presenting your client’s case. You may get lucky, and slip one past the court. However, if you are caught, even after the fact, then see what happens to your ability to practice law, ball-less shill.) In the end, as an attorney, your credibility is crucial - if you want to make a living in this supposed “profession.”

    It is clearly immoral and unethical for ANY alleged non-profit “institution of higher learning” to mislead its students - and the public - about the benefits of a law degree. Also, if Melvin Schweitzer feels that college graduates are automatically “reasonable consumers," then why in the hell is Bernard Madoff sitting in prison?!?! After all, his defrauded clients included truly sophisticated, wealthy, business-savvy, powerful, connected and highly intelligent families and individuals. Don’t forget about the leading investment houses, equity funds, capital management firms, banks, financial institutions, established charities, country clubs, and universities that fell for Madoff's scheme.

    http://articles.businessinsider.com/2008-12-23/wall_street/30004382_1_madoff-investments-fairfield-greenwich-group-fairfield-greenwich-group

    Don’t bother answering this rhetorical question, Chicago troll. This contrast further illustrates that in the U.S., it is perfectly okay to defraud students and the average man, woman and family - as long as you do not injure wealthy and powerful people and institutions.

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  17. Nando: I'm looking at what you just wrote, and then I ask myself, does this person deserve to be a lawyer? Does this person deserve to have a big stake in people's future?

    The answer is obviously no. The rejects, the refuse, the dregs of the human race need to be weeded out. So what, the law schools twist a few facts and a few defectives like you get tossed. Who cares? Any half-wit in the world can see past their advertisements. Simply put, if you only go by their rosy shiny little webpages, and then you spend three long years in law school full-well knowing the job market, and then you end out failing, then it is NOT the fault of the one webpage with the statistics on it. Give me a fucking break.

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  18. ^

    Listen, pal, there are two certainties in this situation:

    1. You have been called a pompous asshole before;
    2. Get some original stuff. We have heard your kind of bullshit before.

    And if I would be you, at this point I would find a girlfriend. Your right hand must be tired.

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  19. http://ip-whois-lookup.com/lookup.php?ip=69.209.55.176

    Visits: 10
    Unique ID: 3806755814
    IP address: 69.209.55.176
    Locale: Chicago, IL, USA / English
    Platform: Internet Explorer 8.0 / Windows 7 / 1366x768

    Mar 25 2012 7:49pm 69.209.55.176 3 actions 9m 30s
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    Mar 25 2012 11:12am 69.209.55.176 1 action 10s
    Mar 25 2012 10:09am 69.209.55.176 3 actions 9m 1s
    Mar 25 2012 9:48am 69.209.55.176 2 actions 12s
    Mar 25 2012 9:23am 69.209.55.176 2 actions 3m 32s
    Mar 25 2012 9:03am 69.209.55.176 2 actions 6m 1s
    Mar 25 2012 7:42am 69.209.55.176 1 action 10s

    Hello, pussy. Seeing your 7:58 pm response above, it appears that you are either a pathetic ABA shill or academic. A real man would have replied with stronger language. By the way, borderline retard: social Darwinism was DISCREDITED pretty much as soon as it was proclaimed. Look up that piece of trash known as Herbert Spencer, when you are not busy blowing homeless men. The bald chimp simply provided a bastardized version of evolution, in order to justify social and economic inequality.

    In the end, social Darwinism is about as valid as eugenics, cockroach. If this theory had any weight, then you would not have made it out of the womb, bitch. By the way, if you believe in social Darwinism, then have some balls and identify yourself. Stand by your remarks, and don’t hide behind a laptop.

    I have already mentioned this on the blog before, but I will restate it for your benefit: I went to Third Tier Drake on a full-tuition scholarship. During the application process, I told my friends and family that I would not attend law school if I did not receive such an offer. In sum, I made sure to at least minimize the economic risk. As a result, my combined student loan debt is much less than that of MOST law grads.

    Lastly, by YOUR sick logic and complete lack of ethics, it is okay to rape mentally challenged people. (Perhaps, this is due to your inability to get laid - short of causing a slow person to become drunk.) The world is a corrupt place. However, imagine if everyone subscribed to your ridiculous beliefs. People would not need to inform their partners that they have HIV or AIDS.

    It would be socially acceptable for manufacturers to sell flammable children’s pajamas. Hell, based on your warped views, it would be okay for the company to lie and say that the pajamas have been tested and shown to be non-flammable - when in fact no such tests have been performed.

    Have you ever stopped to consider why we have several safeguards in place, mental deficient?!?! This entry pertains to a certain pig named Melvin Shweitzer. Your comments are not furthering the discussion. After looking at your syntax and weak-ass arguments, you are probably a high school loser, with essentially no life experience. Go back to your coloring book, bitch.

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  20. Keep up the good work - great blog!

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  21. Assuming Nando didn't ban the guy's IP, here goes:

    I read your bullshit. Here are some questions raised: Does this person have the honesty or ethics to be a lawyer? Does this person deserve to have any stake in people's future? Does the thought of this person raising kids scare the shit out of anyone else?

    Dude, you have no ethics. You think that lawyers are paid to lie. That the feeble minded should be 'weeded out'. (Is there some reason why you left yourself out of this last category?) You are a fucking sociopath. Any single women in Chicago on here? If so, avoid this psychopath at all costs.

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  22. The judge is a bagman for industry...

    And this surprises you?

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  23. Kevin Johnson, from the CBS feature, will not be able to pay 200K plus in student loan debt unless he is making much more than what serving pizza pays.

    He might land a lucrative job, but if he does not, he will have to defer his loans, and his debt will have added on interest and penalties that will climb well past the 320K mark that I have reached.

    The problem is is that gaps in employment with nothing to fill but explanations as to why one was serving pizza or cleaning houses or painting look very bad to a prospective employer.

    The first few years out of law school are extremely critical within which to land professional and well paying employment, or the race against the Sl debt is lost forever, and one is out of the job market and staring down ever increasing SL debt financial punishment until past retirement and ultimate death.

    A select few profit very well from this system, and they will do their best to keep it all going for as long as they can.

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  24. Painter is back! You oughtta tell the newcomers what your original student debt was when you graduated from law school. And then tell the kids where it stands now. Or how much it increases every month.

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  25. This is "69.209.55.176" again, although my IP address may be different now.

    To Nando, 10:12, etc: You make this assumption that I'm a lawyer, or a wannabe future lawyer. In fact I'm not. I rather despise lawyers, especially the ones coming from "Third Tier Schools". They often have no ethics and will twist reality to suit their clients' needs, with the goal of increasing their personal income. Then I look at this "law school scam" and it seems so miniscule in comparison. A misleading webpage? How does this compare with the numerous sleazeballs out there who defend all these frivolous lawsuits full-well knowing they have no case and are effectively just trying to take money they don't deserve? And you people embraced this profession. You tried to become one of these degenerates and failed. I say, excellent. You can act all victimized, but in the end all you tried to do was become a degenerate shyster, failed, and are now pretending to be a victim the way you would have portrayed your clients had you succeeded in your career goals.

    And don't pretend you aren't one of the bad ones, that you had noble goals in going into law. Most of you were just out for the $$$ and then fell for a totally obvious twisting of facts that any half-brain could figure out. Good riddance, the fewer lawyers the better.

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  26. Just want to correct my last comment: Many of you didn't fall for this obvious twisting of facts as you are portraying. A lot of you thought you would beat the odds, or simply didn't investigate the situation before going to law school and were just blinded by the thought of all the $$$$$ you'd get defending personal injury cases or whatever bullshit field you wanted to specialize in.

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  27. ^That's called capitalism, pal.

    People trying to move ahead in the world. You think chefs are doing their job for the love of cooking only? They want to be paid for their work. Think baseball players take the field for the love of the game? They are making millions.

    People go to law school because they don't want to be one of those guys carrying a Little Caesar's Pizza sign and dancing and waving to passers by. They don't want to be a 60 year salesman at a fucking furniture store, working on full commission. They don't want to sell vaccuum cleaners door to door. They want a chance at a good life, like the Boomers were able to have with less education.

    And that's why I don't see this glut scaring away too many future lawyers. People would rather take the risk of being a professional rather than sell shoes for a living.

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  28. That judge was wrong to dismiss the suit.

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  29. Now, the word is getting out about the sorry state of the legal profession. When I went to law school, I read the USNWR and a few other publications and my law school listed 98% employment, with a median of $75K at the time. Then you get those glossy brochures from the law schools about all the great things graduates are doing.

    There was no place I can think about, where I would have found any balanced information. It was only through living it that I experienced what I experienced. I was amazed at the number of people that had no job at graduation. I went to a top twenty law school. Classmates were working as waiters and shoe salespeople after graduation. I had no job, I received hundreds of rejection letters. How would I know this was a possible fate before I was admitted?

    I can honestly say if I had known any of this before I started down the law school path, I would not have gone. The anxiety, anger, and uncertainty was not worth it. I didn't pay the equivalent in today's dollars of 50K a semester for a chance. The law schools were dishonest and misleading about the opportunities available to graduates.

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  30. AnonymousMar 27, 2012 06:52 AM
    Most of you were just out for the $$$
    ________________________________________________

    So I guess we can assume you work for free?

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  31. We all work for money. My masseuse does a great job, and we are also friends. She still charges me. And I continue to pay her for her work.

    You bet your ass I went to law school for the money. Maybe you've noticed the law schools are chargeing an arm, a leg and an asshole in tuition fees. People usually want a positive ROI. So you pay big money to go to law school and you want to be able to repay those loans and have a good life.

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  32. The law school scam is a lot like affirmative action and the professors are the race pimps. At what point do we stop giving people advantages because of the color of their skin and at what point should there be no excuse that if you choose to go law school, especially at a 4th tier crapper, that you cant blame the school because you could not get a job when you were done. I seriously doubt morons who choose to go to law school would have done it differently if the schools said that a law degree is no guarantee of a legal job on the front page of their website or brochure. Kids who want to be lawyers think they will beat the odds and save the world or make a bunch of money. The excuses ring hollow today more then ever.

    When I went to my 4th tier crapper 20 years ago I didnt even look at what the job statistics were. I knew it would be tough to get a job but I went to delay having to get a shit job with no room for advancement hoping law might provide me with some options going forward that I would not have with a political science degree. Law pays well over time even if that means you have to go out on your own and kids know this when they compare it to the job they can get with a liberal arts degree. They risk it like some people risk an investment in a business.

    The face of education is changing yearly and people weigh the risks based on knowledge provided on blogs like this. The schools are not lacking applications and students for whatever reason so if you dont want to play the game, go home. If you do and you fail you knew the risk and it had nothing to do with a brochure about employment statistics.

    Does anyone actually believe the overall USA unemployment is 8-9% because the gvt says it is? We go forward expecting some level of bs no matter what we do. Its about taking risk.


    The game needs to be changed as these professors who have never practiced law get rich bsing impressionable students but if you choose to participate in todays modern information age, dont whine when you fail.

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  33. These students took a calculated risk and the lost. That doesn't make Pig Schweitzer's POLITICAL DECISION okay. For those who feel that I am going after the wrong person, keep in mind that I have read the entire 35 page decision granting NYL$'s motion to dismiss.

    http://cache.abovethelaw.com/uploads/2012/03/NYLS-Class-Action-Dismissal-Order.pdf

    Head to this link, and follow Schweitzer’s rationale. Above the Law provided this, on its cache. The piece of garbage engaged in legal gymnastics, in order to justify his ruling. Take a look at his dismissive tone.

    On page 4 of the decision, i.e. page 5 of the PDF, the cockroach wrote:

    “In two years, 2005 and 2006, NYLS did not report the percentage of graduates on which the compensation statistic was based at all.”

    Furthermore, check out this excerpt on page 14 of the decision – which is page 15 of the PDF:

    “As to the salary data being misleading because it allegedly was based on a “deliberately selected” small sample of graduates, the relatively small percentage of responding students was disclosed whenever the salary data included the average salary statistic. Namely, for the years 2010, 2009 and 2007, the NYLS marketing material clearly stated that the salary statistic was based on approximately 26 percent, 20 percent and 25 percent, respectively, of employed graduates. See Amended Complaint, Exs. 2, 3,4. For 2005 and 2006, the NYLS marketing materials merely disclosed a median or average range of salaries depending on employment settings graduates chose to work in and qualified the disclosure with the limiting phrase, “based upon salaries reported.”

    Apparently, the bastard does not feel that this is relevant to the plaintiffs in this case. Hell, on page 3 of the decision, the pig notes that Renee Rivas “is the only graduate of the nine plaintiffs to have chosen to enter NYLS in 2008, the year the Great Recession began.” SchweiTTTzer makes a point of relying on the economy, in reaching his conclusion that students should have done more research before deciding to attend NYL$.

    How could any of these students have foreseen the economic situation in 2008? While automation and globalization have been affecting various industries for decades – and the law schools have been overproducing JDs for years - even academic and “professional” economists did not predict the disastrous results.

    In the final analysis, the piece of trash had already made up his mind to dismiss the class action lawsuit against this infamous, decrepit third tier commode. As most judges, liberal and conservative, he then sought out a rationale to support his conclusions. Melvin Schweitzer made a point of noting that nearly all of the plaintiffs entered law school prior to “the Great Recession” – and graduated into it – but then he does not take the lack of disclosure on the number of grads reporting salary info, in 2005 or 2006, into account. The "man" is an intellectual fraud.

    ReplyDelete
  34. Useful information ..I am very happy to read this article..thanks for giving us this useful information. Fantastic walk - through. I appreciate this post.

    ReplyDelete
  35. It's obvious this judge wanted to dismiss the case. I just wasted a half hour of my life reading his decision. I would've learned more by watching The Simpsons.

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  36. And they're talking about opening another for-profit (I assume) school in Daytona Beach, FL:

    http://www.news-journalonline.com/news/local/east-volusia/2012/03/28/law-school-possible-at-old-daytona-police-building.html

    The area is "underserved" by law schools!?

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  37. "Lawyers don't serve pizza"...

    they can if they graduate from NYLS.

    I knew a guy that graduated from Georgetown Law and he was working in a call center,

    ReplyDelete
  38. There is a great disconnect between what law schools promise and what they deliver to the vast majority of their students and graduates.

    To the people who say that students should not go to law school for the money I ask, if that is so shouldn't law schools not charge an arm and a leg for the education. Many of these kids have that whole wide eyed doe caught in headlights look and believe that law school administrators can be trusted to tell them the truth.

    Once they pass the bar they must then pay for CLE's, bar dues, and their student loans. That also does not include other operating costs. The practice of law is not cheap and law schools are not cheap to attend either. Schools may not explicitly say we promise you a good job when you get out but they do rely heavily on that assumption in brochures and marketing materials to get more students in.

    I think it is weird that law schools harp on under and unemployed law graduates for not doing due diligence on the employment statistics when they were undergrads. It is almost like they are saying "hey we kinda lied and we are misleading them but its not unethical because they should know not to trust us".

    I mean lets say I owned a business and my marketing material says that 80% of my investors get a 10 - 20% yearly return. However, I know that only 10% of my investors get that and the rest only get at best a 1- 2% return. And just to make it better most of my investors had to take out business loans that cannot be discharged in bankruptcy. Can I then say hey you should have known I would try to mislead you to get your money, sure I don't have transparency but it is what it is.

    Sorry for the long post/rant. Just Some Thoughts. ;)

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  39. This retarded judge will get his decision remanded. Summary judgment was completely improper in this case.

    P.S. Georgetown law is a fucking trap scam school. Have fun working at a call center when you graduate.

    P.S.S. Admin from JDunderground is a piece of shit.

    ReplyDelete
  40. ^JD Underground is shit.

    ReplyDelete
  41. What, another law school in Jacksonville Florida?! I know that Florida Coastal, a for profit law school, is already in Jacksonville (I was getting spammed by them constantly when deciding to go to law school).

    ReplyDelete
  42. I did a stint working in a telemarketing call center (boiler room) after graduating from law school.

    It was a big lesson in humility, and I would never be rude to a telemarketer ever again.

    ReplyDelete
  43. I worked in a call center during law school. The team had about 15 people on it. Two girls were almost finishing up their Master's degrees. ANother had hers. And there was another law student.

    Education is a scam. Know that right now. Quit believing in higher ed.

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  44. They told the people in the telemarketing call center I worked in to always stay with the script.

    To never stray from the script.

    And to use the assumptive close, as in: "How will you be paying for this Mrs. Smith? With a Credit Card?

    If Mrs. Smith said no, it was: "With a Check?" etc.

    ReplyDelete
  45. I'm glad some of the scambloggers are still going strong. Good things are happening because of your efforts. Remember that. But don't let up on these fucks.

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  46. Calm down. Judge is right. Cat is out of the bag. As the judge says, if New York Law School is the best school you can get into, you should expect you will likely "toil (perhaps partime) in drudgery" (as a Starbucks barista). Especially if you are not at the top of the class. True to a lesser extent at better schools. There are no guarantees in life. People should not expect to get jobs if they are unsuccessful in school. You don't get a job just for attending.

    On this blog, you even tar and feather decent schools (like GW and Temple) and assert that job prospects coming out of these schools are dim--with little to no support for the statement.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Dude, what about the banks that lend money for these degrees? Is it okay to lie to them too? I think that's called conspiracy to commit wire fraud.

      Delete
  47. To the tool above:

    Essentially no recent law grads are saying that they should be guaranteed jobs simply for sitting in a classroom for an additional three years, idiot. (Perhaps, kids from wealthy families feel this way. Then again, they are accustomed to having their parents make a couple of phone calls, on their behalf.) Take that straw man argument somewhere else, 8:11 pm.

    The law schools at Temple University and George Washington are dung heaps. If that offends your sensibilities, then you need to stick to Disney animated movies. This blog relies heavily on statistics, charts, graphs, industry statements, BLS data, and figures supplied by the law schools, NALP, US "News" and the ABA.

    By the way, imagine if you - and other shills - said to students enrolled in veterinary, medical and dental school that they need to be in the top of the class. They would probably laugh in your face, bitch. By the way, when you make that weak-ass "argument," you ADMIT that the law schools are accepting too many students - and pumping out far too many graduates.

    ReplyDelete
  48. Its slash and burn, baby...
    Professors and Law Schools realize that!

    ReplyDelete
  49. Law school is stressful enough. Finding a job shouldn’t make it worse. I work with JD Match, a company striving to add some much needed sanity to the recruiting process. Using a sophisticated matching algorithm, they can help you be discovered by employers looking for what you have to offer. Visit their site to see how it works, sign up for a free membership, and get some control over the recruitment process. http://bit.ly/H3J0LU

    ReplyDelete
  50. As if law school wasn’t stressful enough, soon you will have to think about finding a job. I work with JD Match, where they make finding the AmLaw firm that’s right for you – and better yet – the firm that’s looking to hire someone with your qualifications – easier. Check out JD Match, learn about their sophisticated matching algorithm and sign up for a free membership today. A few minutes of your time could get you on the path to real experience. http://bit.ly/H13JX9

    ReplyDelete
  51. Law school is stressful enough. Finding a job shouldn’t make it worse. I work with JD Match, a company striving to add some much needed sanity to the recruiting process. Using a sophisticated matching algorithm, they can help you be discovered by employers looking for what you have to offer. Visit their site to see how it works, sign up for a free membership, and get some control over the recruitment process. http://bit.ly/Hmgr0Z

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. How do you get the firms to divulge their data?

      Delete
  52. To Nando, I didn't say you have to be at the top of the class at schools like GW and Fordham. I don't agree that those schools are even fairly profiled on this blog. But if you go to New York Law School, yes, you better believe you have to be at the top of the class to have a hope of getting ANY marginally decent legal job. Thus, I agree with you that these schools should not exist at all. Well, not at the prices they charge. It would be fine for schools that are graduating students only capable of earning some $50,000 to exist if they weren't so damn expensive.

    I would be interested in seeing the profit marigns at these schools compared to good schools. I don't know how they can justify charging the same price. Your solo practioner in Little Town, Wyoming doesn't charge the same price as your V10 1500 lawyer firm based out of New York. I think the schools justification is that they need to pay high salaries to attract quality professors. But that obviously is not helping the students. They would learn the same thing and have the same job prospects if far less 'credentialed' and sophisticated professors were hired. They'de just have a lot less debt.

    Also, your comparison to medicine is really not fair. It's a much smaller market. And the students at the worst medical school are far closer to the students at the best medical school in terms of GPA and MCAT than law students.

    ReplyDelete
  53. Law school is stressful enough. Finding a job shouldn’t make it worse. I work with JD Match, a company striving to add some much needed sanity to the recruiting process. Using a sophisticated matching algorithm, they can help you be discovered by employers looking for what you have to offer. Visit their site to see how it works, sign up for a free membership, and get some control over the recruitment process. http://bit.ly/HlrmYY

    ReplyDelete
  54. Check out Staci Zaretsky's follow-up entry on Pig Melvin Schweitzer, from March 23, 2012. It is entitled "You Should Have Known Better Than To Go To Law School." A great excerpt:

    http://abovethelaw.com/2012/03/you-should-have-known-better-than-to-go-to-law-school/

    "But we’re told that these prospective law students, as “sophisticated” as they are, should have known better than to believe their law schools — or hell, they should’ve known better than to apply to law school in the first place. Apparently these “sophisticated consumers,” the same ones who don’t know what the hell they signed when they accepted the terms of their loan agreements, should have seen it coming.

    But in truth, these prospective law students aren’t “sophisticated” in any way, shape, or form, and their utter lack of sophistication is only exacerbated when law schools lie to their faces. Even if some model citizen had done all of the research imaginable before deciding to go to law school, it’s still highly likely that he wouldn’t know which end was up in terms of the “factual” bullsh*t being spewed in his face.

    And in the case of the NYLS plaintiffs, Schweitzer’s decision tells us in no uncertain terms they should’ve known that they would someday be able to wipe their asses with their law degrees simply based on the school’s mediocre U.S. News ranking. When Schweitzer more or less tells us that “only idiots trust law schools,” that doesn’t offer any assistance to the idiot who did trust his law school.

    So what’s a once bright-eyed and bushy-tailed law student to do? What recourse do these now unemployed or underemployed law school graduates have? Are they supposed to calmly accept the fact that they’ll be slinging french fries or reviewing documents until the cows come home? Puh-lease.

    The world isn’t going to magically change for these people, but maybe some kind of change can be had for the future generation of “sophisticated consumers.” Maybe the law school industry will stop feeding prospective law students the bullsh*t they’ve been swallowing for years. Maybe someone, somewhere — be it a law school administrator or an ABA decision maker — will decide that this madness has got to end."

    In the end, Melvin Schweitzer is a corporate pig. His mother must be very proud, of her ball-less shill.

    ReplyDelete

 
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