Tuesday, September 19, 2017

One Quarter of ABA-Accredited Diploma Mills Plan to Use GRE Scores for Admissions, Per Kaplan Survey


TTT News: On September 18, 2017, Kathryn Rubino posted an ATL entry labeled “25 Percent Of Law Schools Say They Plan To Choose The GRE.” Read this opening:

“Being able to take the GRE in lieu of the LSAT and still get into law school is a relatively new concept. It wasn’t too long ago that Arizona made shockwaves in legal education by announcing the LSAT — seen as a rite of passage by many lawyers — was no longer required to go to their school, and students could take the GRE instead. Now that idea has germinated, and, well — it is getting more popular. 

In a survey done by Kaplan Test Prep of admissions officials from 128 law schools, a full 25 percent say accepting the GRE is an admission policy they plan on implementing. That’s a huge shift — in a similar survey last year, only 14 percent of law schools said they were thinking of accepting the GRE. The schools that say they are unsure remained constant year-to-year at 30 percent, and those that say they will not accept the GRE fell from 56 percent to 45 percent. That means the 11 percent increase in schools now onboard with the exam came from the group of schools that had said they were against the move last year.

So — why they big change? Well, to paraphrase South Park — Harvard did it.

That’s right, amid some controversy, earlier this year Harvard announced they would now accept the GRE. As one might imagine, when such a prominent school made the move, it opened the floodgates for others to follow. This summer, two other elite law schools, Northwestern and Georgetown, announced they were accepting the GRE. It’s officially open season on the LSAT.

According to Kaplan’s survey, the “me too!” logic is in full effect for those eyeing the move to the GRE, with respondents saying:

I’m thinking that it’s going to become the norm. It’s one of those situations where you’re going to be left behind.


We plan to do it in part because Harvard is doing it. When they do things, people tend to fall in line, thinking it’s right.

But that route is not without peril. The ABA’s current rule allows law schools to accept an alternative to the LSAT if said alternative is proven “valid and reliable.” Only catch? They still haven’t weighed in on the validity studies done for the GRE to meet their standard. That fact was weighing on the minds of admissions professionals Kaplan surveyed: 

Many people here don’t hold the same opinion about the validity of the GRE. We would also like to know the ABA’s disposition. Validity studies cost money and with law schools strapped for cash, that’s not easy.” [Emphasis mine]

Of course, the pigs are willing to accept the GRE as an alternate to the LSAT. It is offered more frequently, and it is typically taken by idiots seeking PhDs in Anthropology or a Master’s degree in French Literature. By the way, it is adorable that skeptics think that each ABA diploma factory will have to bear the costs of a validity study. If Harvard – or Georgetown – comes up with “confirmation” that the GRE is a valid and reliable entrance exam, then it will be accepted by the dolts at the American Bar Association. Just think of industry standards that are adopted in other areas of commerce.


Other Coverage: On September 18, 2017, the ABA Journal featured a Stephanie Francis Ward piece entitled “More law schools plan to accept GRE scores, but there’s still hesitation, survey finds.” Review the following portion:

“In its 2017 survey of law school admissions offices, Kaplan Test Prep found that there’s a sharp increase in those planning to accept Graduate Records Examination scores from applicants.

According to answers to a survey of 128 law schools released Monday, 25 percent indicated that they plan to implement the GRE in admissions. In 2016, only 14 percent of the schools surveyed planned to add the GRE as an admissions test option along with the Law School Admissions Test.

Several law schools, including the University of Arizona’s James E. Rogers College of Law, Harvard Law School, Northwestern University Pritzker School of Law and Georgetown Law School–the largest in the nation–currently accept or are planning to accept GRE scores in admissions. 

The standard regarding entrance tests for ABA-accredited law schools is under consideration by the council of the organization’s Section of Legal Education and Admissions to the Bar. The proposed revision to Standard 503 calls for the council to establish a process that determines reliability and validity of other tests besides the LSAT. That’s a change from the current version, which directs law schools using alternate admissions tests to demonstrate that the exams are valid and reliable. The council is expected to discuss the issue in November, according to a memo from Barry Currier, the the ABA’s managing director of accreditation and legal education.” [Emphasis mine]

As you can see, a mere council of the ABA’s $ecTTTion of Legal EducaTTTion and Admi$$ion$ to the Bar – comprised of lazy academics – can revise Standard 503. This means that individual cesspools will not have to shell out funds to show that the GRE is a valid alternative to the LSAT.

Conclusion: In the final analysis, the ABA council will come up with a rationale “showing” that the GRE is a wonderful and amazing entrance exam. Hell, they’ll probably declare that it is superior to the LSAT. When this occurs, expect the Biglaw types and “legal scholars” at that racketeer influenced and corrupt organization to rubber stamp this TTT decision by proclamation/voice vote. Why not just require prospective law students to write a short essay, stating the reasons why they want to practice law?


  1. Trolling the waters for students who are taking the GRE, but not committed to the law or even thinking about the law. Casting a wider net, even for people who don't know they even want to be in the net in the first place.

    At least the LSAT is a one-to-one correlation: if you are taking the LSAT, you are either (1) taking it for fun, or (2) you want to be admitted to law school. Not much of a bar, but at least people have to be "committed."

    What's next? Medical schools accepting the LSAT? That is about as logical as what is going on currently.

  2. An example of how law schools teach their students to think creatively and independently: Wait a moment, see what Harvard does, and then play "follow the leader" like sheep. That's thinking like a lawyer, folks!
    It's kind of like how they teach students ethics: lie to them about job prospects, market to people hopelessly incapable of achieving the end goal, screw them over financially, REALLY screw them over financially, send them off into practice with so much debt they're hungry to screw over their OWN clients, and tell them, "be ethical".
    This GRE business is custom-cut to serve one purpose only: reel in the fence-sitting liberal artists who have already taken the GRE but don't know what they'd like to do with their lives. They don't have to wait for the next LSAT sitting, they can get into law school all online, NOW!

  3. "... [The GRE] is typically taken by idiots seeking PhDs in Anthropology or a Master’s degree in French Literature."

    Not necessarily.

    The GRE is required by engineering programs, STEM programs, veterinarian schools, nursing, PA and PT schools, and now most MBA programs (in lieu of the GMAT). In some cases, a subject-specific test is also required (such as with psychology), but the norm is just to take the general GRE.

    Also, keep in mind that the more competitive graduate programs won't even look at you unless you score at least a 315 (about 80th %ile), which eliminates all the dummies from consideration.

  4. Expect a brawl over this proposal. Big-time scamster Kellye Testy, apparently in less than two years, has risen from dean of the law school at the University of Washington (salary $352k in 2009) to head of the Association of American Law Schools (AssOALS, apparently their incompetent spelling of "assholes") and now to CEO of the LSAC, which not only coordinates admissions but also produces and administers the LSAT. The LSAC will oppose efforts to undermine its monopoly.

    And I, incidentally, will support the LSAC on that point (even while opposing its general promotion of the law-school scam). The LSAT is a valid test that usefully separates the sheep from the goats. The GRE has its role but not in admissions to law school. I vigorously oppose any attempt to displace the one objective element of the application with a competing test that serves a different purpose.

  5. By the way, it's quite true that the law skules will tend to ape Harvard in almost every area other than standards for admission. Harvard thus served the scam well by accepting the GRE. Thanks, Harvard, for advancing the intere$t$ of sleazy scamsters at the expense of the legal profession and the public. Nicely played, first-tier toilet.

    1. http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/law_profs_donation_gets_him_naming_rights_to_harvard_law_school_restroom/

      Old Guy, you may recall this ABA Journal article from Debra Cassens Weiss. It was published on February 8, 2012, under the headline "Law Prof's Donation Gets Him Naming Rights to Harvard Law School Restroom." Here is the full text below:

      "Berkeley law professor William Falik has obtained naming rights to a restroom at Harvard Law School with a $100,000 donation.

      Falik told Above the Law and the Daily Californian blog that he obtained naming rights after discussions with the school’s dean at the time—Elena Kagan. Outside the restroom in Harvard’s new Wasserstein Hall is a plaque identifying the “Falik Men’s Room” as a result of a gift by Falik, a 1971 alum.

      “I have a name that doesn’t go many places,” Falik told the Daily Californian. “I think it’s somewhat humorous to have my name outside of a men’s room.”

      Falik already has a history of restroom naming rights. He made a large donation to the Berkeley Repertory Theatre, which named the “Falik Gentleman’s Lounge” in his honor. He tells the Daily Californian he also donated $125,000 to Berkeley law school and may get a restroom there named in his honor.

      Above the Law says Falik made his fortune as a lawyer and real estate developer."

      This shows that Harvard Law School is an ABA-accredited toilet. Hell, the university has a massive endowment. Yet, the law school now has a restroom named after a rich donor. This is laughable.


  6. It's still going to be tough as hell to get into Harvard Law. They can choose whoever they want.

    It's just going to be easier than ever to get into your nearest toilet school. Pretty soon, you're not even going to have to have an undergrad degree. All you'll need is federal student loan approval. And let's face it, federal student loan dollars are the only things that matter to today's toilet schools care about anyway.

  7. At this point, why stop at the GRE? The MCAT does not simply test Bio, Chem, Organic Chem, Biochem, and Physics. The exam also tests reading comprehension. Might as well accept an MCAT score too in lieu of the LSAT. Hell, the jig is up. Toilet law schools can sell themselves as the backup plan for pre-meds, MBA applicants, and other graduate school applicants. The toilets just want the student loan dollars. “MCAT not up to par? Miss out on med school this year. Come to Cooley!”

  8. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJ4SSvVbhLw

    Carlin on the dumbing down of America.

    'We need more testing for the kids. You say to them 'Well, 'ya know, we've tried all of that. And the kid still can't pass the test. Says 'Ah don't you worry about that. We're gonna lower the passing grades.' That's what they do in a lot of these schools now. They lower the passing grads so more kids can pass. More kids pass, the school looks good. Everybody's happy. The IQ of the country slips another 2 or 3 points. And pretty soon all you'll need to get into college is a fuckin' pencil. Got a pencil? Get the fuck in there. It's Phsyics.'

    1. Pretty soon all you'll need to get into law school is a fuckin' pencil. Got a pencil? Get the fuck in there. It's civ pro.

  9. The problem with using the GRE, is that it will take approximately a decade for it to become apparent what the GRE minimum scores are for people who will later pass the bar. In the meantime a whole bunch of shitty law schools will be able to dodge reporting their low LSAT scores by steering applicants to the GRE. For any grift, even a long term one, 10 years is an eternity. Anything to avoid accountability!

  10. Nando and Alan Collinge: Veterans in the pursuit of correcting decades of student loan injustice. Both very dedicated and hats off to both.

  11. https://www.americanbar.org/content/dam/aba/administrative/legal_education_and_admissions_to_the_bar/governancedocuments/2017_managing_director_memo_on_s503.authcheckdam.pdf

    Courtesy of the ABA, here is Pig Currier’s statement, in part:


    The recent reports by two schools that they will join two other law schools in permitting applicants to apply with a Graduate Record Exam (GRE) score without a Law School Admission Test (LSAT) score has generated attention and comment. The following intends to put these announcements, and this matter generally, in context.

    Standard 503 of the ABA Standards for Approval of Law Schools mandates that a law school require applicants to submit a valid and reliable law school admission test score as part of their application. Interpretation 503-1 accepts that the LSAT is such a test; further, it allows schools to use another test if the school demonstrates that it is valid and reliable for that institution. Interestingly, the Standard requires schools to use admission test scores consistently with guidance provided by the test maker, but it does not actually require that the law school use the score in any specific way, or at all.

    Law schools know that if they accept an admission test other than the LSAT, they risk a subsequent determination by the Council of the Section of Legal Education and Admissions to the Bar that the test is not a valid and reliable admission test for that school under Interpretation 503-1. The law schools announcing that they will accept a GRE score in lieu of an LSAT score have had studies done which, in their views, establish the validity and reliability of the GRE for their admissions process. But, they all know that decision is ultimately for the Accreditation Committee and the Council to make.

    If a law school is determined to have been operating out of compliance with the ABA Standards for Approval of Law Schools, the accreditation process has procedures for requiring it to take steps to come back into compliance with the Standards. In this situation, that process would likely include a requirement that the law school stop using that test, and it could lead to additional sanctions as provided in the Rules of Procedure.

    The Council currently has out for notice and comment a proposed change to Standard 503 that would make several changes to the Standard and its Interpretations, including eliminating Int. 503-1. The proposal under consideration would establish a process to approve tests other than the LSAT for use by all law schools and would eliminate any individual school's ability to use a test that has not be approved by the Council."

    Now, low-ranked schools and diploma mills can rely on Harvard’s decision to accept the GRE in lieu of an LSAT score. By the way, Harvard will be able to show that those with exceptional scores on the GraduaTTTe Record Exam can do well in law school – and that they can also pass the bar exam. Of course, this is not the case at TTTs or TTTTs. Expect the ABA dolts to easily pass this measure.

  12. In 5 years they'll be using the "Which Star Wars Character Are You" internet quiz as an entry exam....

  13. http://abovethelaw.com/2017/09/another-law-school-bows-to-the-inevitable-and-accepts-the-gre/

    Today, at 1:29 pm, Kathryn Rubino posted an ATL entry entitled “Another Law School Bows To The Inevitable And Accepts The GRE.” Here is the full text of her article:

    “If you want to go to law school but don’t want to take the LSAT, the list of law schools you can attend has just grown by one. Now, in addition to Harvard, Northwestern, Georgetown, and Arizona, you can also take you talents to Honolulu.

    Late last week the University of Hawaii William S. Richardson School of Law announced they would accept the GRE in lieu of the LSAT on a one-year trial basis, noting they’ve already done studies to validate the move:

    The Law School faculty’s decision to pilot the GRE® General Test followed the Law School’s role as one of the first three law schools to have completed a validation study of the GRE® test in collaboration with Educational Testing Service. The 2016 Richardson data showed that GRE® scores were a better predictor of first-year law school grades than were undergraduate grades.

    The Richardson pilot program analysis also noted that previous research had already shown that the GRE® General Test was a valid and reliable measure to predict academic performance in law school.

    A recent Kaplan Test Prep survey found 25 percent of law schools intend to accept the GRE as an entrance exam. Though the first study that looked at the validity of the GRE as an alternative to the LSAT was conducted by Arizona Law and joined by Wake Forest University School of Law and the University of Hawaii Law School, it wasn’t until Harvard Law made the move to accept anything other than the LSAT that a critical mass of law schools began to seriously consider the GRE as a law school entrance exam.

    As more and more schools accept the GRE, it’s clear that the grueling LSAT will no longer be a shared rite of passage for all attorneys. Hawaii may be the fifth school to accept the GRE, but they surely won’t be the last.”

    ABA-accredited diploma factories will make sure to take full advantage of this development. Plus, US “News” & World Report will not have a measurement for accepted GRE scores, at least not for some time. Expect the law schools to “encourage” certain applicants to take the GRE instead of the LSAT.

  14. Maybe they should use this test.

    1. Don't forget the guy's lawyer (Frito Pendejo) got his law degree from Costco.

  15. The reason Harvard is accepting the GRE is much different than the reason that toilet law schools are considering possibly accepting the GRE. The prototype law prof – a double Ivy, Art III clerkship, big law associate for 2 years blowhard – is going out of style. There is a trend among law schools now to hire JD-PhDs as law profs. The law profs have been lamenting this trend on the blogs lately, because their skill set is no longer valued and they bemoan the fact that the JD-PhDs didn’t go to the most elite schools. Harvard Law is probably accepting the GRE to attract students interested in the JD-PhD tract who will become future law profs. Of course, when evaluating applicant GRE scores, Harvard will only accept 1) applicants with scores in the 99th percentile or 2) any applicant from the family of a wealthy donor. Whereas the toilet law schools will accept anyone who successfully entered their name on the exam.

  16. Harvard had 3 grads from the glass of 2016 who were unemployed and seeking work 10 months after graduation. That was only 0.005% of the class of 598. But for those 3 unemployed individuals, remaining unemployed for 10 months owing $265,800 is a disastrous outcome (tuition and fees are $60,638 and living costs are $27,962).


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